To Infinity War and Beyond: the MCU Thread with Spoilers

Music, books, movies, TV, games, hobbies, food, and potent potables. And forum games! Pour a drink, put on your smoking jacket, light a pipe (of whatever), and settle in.
User avatar
Hugh Akston
Posts: 20322
Joined: 05 May 2010, 15:51
Location: Elev. 5280 ft

Re: To Infinity War and Beyond: the MCU Thread with Spoilers

Post by Hugh Akston »

How so?
"Is a Lulztopia the best we can hope for?!?" ~Taktix®
"Well if they're blaming libertarians again then things must be going back to normal." ~dbcooper
User avatar
Pham Nuwen
Posts: 9367
Joined: 27 Apr 2010, 02:17

Re: To Infinity War and Beyond: the MCU Thread with Spoilers

Post by Pham Nuwen »

What hell it must be. I got the impression the guy vision fingerblasted* is aware of everything that is happening but has absolutely zero control. A puppet. Creepy.

*sorry but that's what i'm calling it
Goddamn libertarian message board. Hugh Akston

leave me to my mescaline smoothie in peace, please. dhex
User avatar
Hugh Akston
Posts: 20322
Joined: 05 May 2010, 15:51
Location: Elev. 5280 ft

Re: To Infinity War and Beyond: the MCU Thread with Spoilers

Post by Hugh Akston »

That's the impression I got too, corroborated by Rambeau's account.
"Is a Lulztopia the best we can hope for?!?" ~Taktix®
"Well if they're blaming libertarians again then things must be going back to normal." ~dbcooper
User avatar
Hugh Akston
Posts: 20322
Joined: 05 May 2010, 15:51
Location: Elev. 5280 ft

Re: To Infinity War and Beyond: the MCU Thread with Spoilers

Post by Hugh Akston »

"Is a Lulztopia the best we can hope for?!?" ~Taktix®
"Well if they're blaming libertarians again then things must be going back to normal." ~dbcooper
User avatar
Pham Nuwen
Posts: 9367
Joined: 27 Apr 2010, 02:17

Re: To Infinity War and Beyond: the MCU Thread with Spoilers

Post by Pham Nuwen »

I just finished the latest episode of WandaVision. I demand a new series with Darcy and Agent Woo going around solving cool mcu related mysteries. I have spoken.
Goddamn libertarian message board. Hugh Akston

leave me to my mescaline smoothie in peace, please. dhex
User avatar
Kolohe
Posts: 14909
Joined: 06 May 2010, 10:51

Re: To Infinity War and Beyond: the MCU Thread with Spoilers

Post by Kolohe »

Pham Nuwen wrote: 14 Feb 2021, 17:29 I just finished the latest episode of WandaVision. I demand a new series with Darcy and Agent Woo going around solving cool mcu related mysteries. I have spoken.
I definitely think that the final scene of the final episode will have some set up and announcement of a spin off show for a supporting character, the way Boba Fett’s was. (It’s probably going to be something staring the Monica Rambeau character, as a YouTube recap pointed out, they made something of her goin thru the hex multiple times and rewriting her biology, and apparently she’s a superhero with super powers in the comic books)

(The second guess would be something with the twins, because they also have comic book stories, but I don’t think Disney wants to lean to heavily on kid actors in the Marvel production line)
when you wake up as the queen of the n=1 kingdom and mount your steed non sequiturius, do you look out upon all you survey and think “damn, it feels good to be a green idea sleeping furiously?" - dhex
User avatar
Pham Nuwen
Posts: 9367
Joined: 27 Apr 2010, 02:17

Re: To Infinity War and Beyond: the MCU Thread with Spoilers

Post by Pham Nuwen »

It's Jimmy and Darcy or I walk, Kolohe.
Goddamn libertarian message board. Hugh Akston

leave me to my mescaline smoothie in peace, please. dhex
User avatar
Kolohe
Posts: 14909
Joined: 06 May 2010, 10:51

Re: To Infinity War and Beyond: the MCU Thread with Spoilers

Post by Kolohe »

Careful, it’s icy out there in most of the country now.

ETA - aren’t both of them already in currently running sitcoms?

ETA 2 ok, only Park is in a network sitcom now, it’s not Dennings, it’s the other broke girl that’s in the Cedric the Entertainer show.
when you wake up as the queen of the n=1 kingdom and mount your steed non sequiturius, do you look out upon all you survey and think “damn, it feels good to be a green idea sleeping furiously?" - dhex
User avatar
Kolohe
Posts: 14909
Joined: 06 May 2010, 10:51

Re: To Infinity War and Beyond: the MCU Thread with Spoilers

Post by Kolohe »

I’m not sure if the Great Reveal in WandaVision was actually lackluster, or if I have only myself to blame - in that watching every analysis & speculation video for prior episodes made this latest episode’s Big Twist underwhelming.

I will say, watching yet another analysis & speculation video improved my opinion of this episode, because there are indeed little things I always miss (and don’t necessarily require comics savvy)
when you wake up as the queen of the n=1 kingdom and mount your steed non sequiturius, do you look out upon all you survey and think “damn, it feels good to be a green idea sleeping furiously?" - dhex
User avatar
dhex
Posts: 16659
Joined: 05 May 2010, 16:05
Location: 'murica

Re: To Infinity War and Beyond: the MCU Thread with Spoilers

Post by dhex »

The wife and kid are watching this but I will say whomever stuffed Kat Denning into a drum major outfit is a goddamn American hero.
"i ran over the cat and didnt stop just carried on with tears in my eyes joose driving my way to work." - God
User avatar
Pham Nuwen
Posts: 9367
Joined: 27 Apr 2010, 02:17

Re: To Infinity War and Beyond: the MCU Thread with Spoilers

Post by Pham Nuwen »

dhex wrote: 21 Feb 2021, 14:17 The wife and kid are watching this but I will say whomever stuffed Kat Denning into a drum major outfit is a goddamn American hero.
All give some. Some give all.
Goddamn libertarian message board. Hugh Akston

leave me to my mescaline smoothie in peace, please. dhex
User avatar
Hugh Akston
Posts: 20322
Joined: 05 May 2010, 15:51
Location: Elev. 5280 ft

Re: To Infinity War and Beyond: the MCU Thread with Spoilers

Post by Hugh Akston »

Gotta say I did not care for the ending of WandaVision. Big CGI jello battles just are not satisfying climaxes. Everything felt kind of perfunctory except for the philosophical debate between the Visions. Also I hope they find a way to make Fietro into the real MCU Pietro.
"Is a Lulztopia the best we can hope for?!?" ~Taktix®
"Well if they're blaming libertarians again then things must be going back to normal." ~dbcooper
User avatar
Kolohe
Posts: 14909
Joined: 06 May 2010, 10:51

Re: To Infinity War and Beyond: the MCU Thread with Spoilers

Post by Kolohe »

My principal objection is Hayward did nothing wrong.

Ok, maybe he’s an asshole that cut corners, but when the inquest hearings start, he’s going to be able to call a hundred witnesses testifying to the evil of Wanda Maximoff, and other evidence that Jimmy Woo, Darcy Lewis, and Monica Rambeau conspired to aid Wanda, and ultimately let her get away. You don’t to get to be where and what Hayward is without superior bureaucratic infighting skills.
when you wake up as the queen of the n=1 kingdom and mount your steed non sequiturius, do you look out upon all you survey and think “damn, it feels good to be a green idea sleeping furiously?" - dhex
User avatar
Hugh Akston
Posts: 20322
Joined: 05 May 2010, 15:51
Location: Elev. 5280 ft

Re: To Infinity War and Beyond: the MCU Thread with Spoilers

Post by Hugh Akston »

If it's true that Hayward did nothing wrong, then it's a pretty scathing indictment of American society and government.

If the expected response to an immensely powerful women experiencing a psychotic break is to go in guns, drones, and androids blazing to start a fight they can't hope to win, it demonstrates not only a serious lack of empathy, but also a troubling willingness to learn from previous encounters where doing just that only provoked her.
"Is a Lulztopia the best we can hope for?!?" ~Taktix®
"Well if they're blaming libertarians again then things must be going back to normal." ~dbcooper
User avatar
dhex
Posts: 16659
Joined: 05 May 2010, 16:05
Location: 'murica

Re: To Infinity War and Beyond: the MCU Thread with Spoilers

Post by dhex »

the wife was kind of disappointed that they had the chance to do a work exploring human emotions and the depths of grief and instead turned it into the usual comic book stuff.

i dunno mang once they didn't kill harry potter (because the sacrifice is the whole point of christ you fucking muppets), so i asked her "how many times you gonna get YA burned til you YA learn?"

my witticism was not appreciated by anyone but me. common state of affairs, sadly.
"i ran over the cat and didnt stop just carried on with tears in my eyes joose driving my way to work." - God
User avatar
D.A. Ridgely
Posts: 21202
Joined: 26 Apr 2010, 17:09
Location: The Other Side

Re: To Infinity War and Beyond: the MCU Thread with Spoilers

Post by D.A. Ridgely »

dhex wrote: 10 Mar 2021, 10:26 the wife was kind of disappointed that they had the chance to do a work exploring human emotions and the depths of grief and instead turned it into the usual comic book stuff.

i dunno mang once they didn't kill harry potter (because the sacrifice is the whole point of christ you fucking muppets), so i asked her "how many times you gonna get YA burned til you YA learn?"

my witticism was not appreciated by anyone but me. common state of affairs, sadly.
That's an interesting take. If we use Aristotle's simplistic aesthetics, it's a comedy if everyone or almost everyone we like survives and a tragedy if they mostly die. A tiny sliver of dramatic works might be deemed christodies, not the least being, um, the New Testament and more tenuously, say, One Flew Over the Cuckoo's Nest.

Yes, as a study of grief and, in particular, grief as a sort of madness, WandaVision dropped the ball. Perfectly understandable there, given we're talking about show business, not art, and that far too many authors have killed off their cash cow protagonist before, from a business pov, they should have. And the Mouse is not interested in your catharsis, doesn't care if a prospective tentpole project doesn't make it into film studies classes except maybe "the economics of film" classes, and would be filming The Further Adventures of Christ if focus groups told them the ratings would be high enough.
User avatar
Kolohe
Posts: 14909
Joined: 06 May 2010, 10:51

Re: To Infinity War and Beyond: the MCU Thread with Spoilers

Post by Kolohe »

I’m going to dissent and say it was a better exploration of grief and madness than the usual Hollywood fare, and, to practice women’s studies without a license, especially for a female character.

Your typical grief madness either is crazy quirky homeless guy haha he’s so funny like Fisher King, or borderline suicidal revenge seeker, like Death Wish, Taken, the majority of Mel Gibson film roles, and even Bourne over the long arc.

Wanda is different than either of these two archetypes. She retreats into the druggy euphoria of a dream world but instead of getting lost in a soap opera or literal drugs a la Requiem for a Dream, she has the power herself to create a new reality and bends people will to it. The Manic Pixie Dream Girl with actual serious and terrifying magic.
when you wake up as the queen of the n=1 kingdom and mount your steed non sequiturius, do you look out upon all you survey and think “damn, it feels good to be a green idea sleeping furiously?" - dhex
User avatar
D.A. Ridgely
Posts: 21202
Joined: 26 Apr 2010, 17:09
Location: The Other Side

Re: To Infinity War and Beyond: the MCU Thread with Spoilers

Post by D.A. Ridgely »

Kolohe wrote: 10 Mar 2021, 15:10 Wanda is different than either of these two archetypes. She retreats into the druggy euphoria of a dream world but instead of getting lost in a soap opera or literal drugs a la Requiem for a Dream, she has the power herself to create a new reality and bends people will to it. The Manic Pixie Dream Girl with actual serious and terrifying magic.
Which makes her preciously little different from the kid in the Twilight Zone "It's a Good Life"episode, albeit she had a known backstory as a motive. But it's still a "power corrupts" story. For everyone else, life give until it starts taking back and there's fuck all anyone can do about it.
User avatar
Kolohe
Posts: 14909
Joined: 06 May 2010, 10:51

Re: To Infinity War and Beyond: the MCU Thread with Spoilers

Post by Kolohe »

Mouse’s other division spent about 20 hours over 40 years on a half assed meditation on mystical powers and the morality of and in their use, but Kevin Feigge was able to drill down on that in a little over two months.
when you wake up as the queen of the n=1 kingdom and mount your steed non sequiturius, do you look out upon all you survey and think “damn, it feels good to be a green idea sleeping furiously?" - dhex
User avatar
Hugh Akston
Posts: 20322
Joined: 05 May 2010, 15:51
Location: Elev. 5280 ft

Re: To Infinity War and Beyond: the MCU Thread with Spoilers

Post by Hugh Akston »

I didn't read it as a 'power corrupts' story. Wanda's powers were more of a metaphorical magnification of her attempts to escape from her trauma, and the post-traumatic effects she was having on the people around her.
"Is a Lulztopia the best we can hope for?!?" ~Taktix®
"Well if they're blaming libertarians again then things must be going back to normal." ~dbcooper
User avatar
D.A. Ridgely
Posts: 21202
Joined: 26 Apr 2010, 17:09
Location: The Other Side

Re: To Infinity War and Beyond: the MCU Thread with Spoilers

Post by D.A. Ridgely »

Hugh Akston wrote: 10 Mar 2021, 16:32 I didn't read it as a 'power corrupts' story. Wanda's powers were more of a metaphorical magnification of her attempts to escape from her trauma, and the post-traumatic effects she was having on the people around her.
So her grief justifies her holding an entire town in thrall?

If she'd just gone ahead to some empty field and created a town, people and ally, okay, maybe. But she's either indifferent or ruthless regarding all those real people she's just using as props for her fantasy. I'd call that a story of how power corrupts.
User avatar
Hugh Akston
Posts: 20322
Joined: 05 May 2010, 15:51
Location: Elev. 5280 ft

Re: To Infinity War and Beyond: the MCU Thread with Spoilers

Post by Hugh Akston »

D.A. Ridgely wrote: 10 Mar 2021, 16:46
Hugh Akston wrote: 10 Mar 2021, 16:32 I didn't read it as a 'power corrupts' story. Wanda's powers were more of a metaphorical magnification of her attempts to escape from her trauma, and the post-traumatic effects she was having on the people around her.
So her grief justifies her holding an entire town in thrall?

If she'd just gone ahead to some empty field and created a town, people and ally, okay, maybe. But she's either indifferent or ruthless regarding all those real people she's just using as props for her fantasy. I'd call that a story of how power corrupts.
Not sure where you're getting me saying it was justified. People act out in weird ways when they have been traumatized, often without meaning to or even realizing they are doing it. Wanda's ability to literally live her own truth gave a more interesting visual/narrative angle on what other movies portray by having characters snap at other people or just stare offscreen.
"Is a Lulztopia the best we can hope for?!?" ~Taktix®
"Well if they're blaming libertarians again then things must be going back to normal." ~dbcooper
User avatar
Jadagul
Posts: 7851
Joined: 26 Apr 2010, 18:51

Re: To Infinity War and Beyond: the MCU Thread with Spoilers

Post by Jadagul »

dhex wrote: 10 Mar 2021, 10:26 the wife was kind of disappointed that they had the chance to do a work exploring human emotions and the depths of grief and instead turned it into the usual comic book stuff.

i dunno mang once they didn't kill harry potter (because the sacrifice is the whole point of christ you fucking muppets), so i asked her "how many times you gonna get YA burned til you YA learn?"

my witticism was not appreciated by anyone but me. common state of affairs, sadly.
I feel like the "coming back to life after the sacrifice" is also a big part of the point of Christ.
User avatar
dead_elvis
Posts: 2000
Joined: 01 May 2010, 15:26

Re: To Infinity War and Beyond: the MCU Thread with Spoilers

Post by dead_elvis »

D.A. Ridgely wrote: 10 Mar 2021, 11:45 and would be filming The Further Adventures of Christ
Now I'm super sad because I really want to see this show. Except that for all the awesome potential it would most likely be squandered.

Reminds me, I haven't caught the 3rd season of Black Jesus yet.

Wandavision was ok, but I think early episodes fell victim to the ironic goat fucker problem. Your spot-on recreations of lame sitcoms full of lame sitcom jokes is... just like watching a lame sitcom.

Also, I'm not sure what their intention was, but it's actually kind of impenetrable to someone not familiar with the MCU. Wife was lost half the time and didn't care for the show.
"Never forget: a war on undocumented immigrants by necessity is a war on all of our freedoms of association and movement."
User avatar
D.A. Ridgely
Posts: 21202
Joined: 26 Apr 2010, 17:09
Location: The Other Side

Re: To Infinity War and Beyond: the MCU Thread with Spoilers

Post by D.A. Ridgely »

Hugh Akston wrote: 10 Mar 2021, 17:02
D.A. Ridgely wrote: 10 Mar 2021, 16:46
Hugh Akston wrote: 10 Mar 2021, 16:32 I didn't read it as a 'power corrupts' story. Wanda's powers were more of a metaphorical magnification of her attempts to escape from her trauma, and the post-traumatic effects she was having on the people around her.
So her grief justifies her holding an entire town in thrall?

If she'd just gone ahead to some empty field and created a town, people and ally, okay, maybe. But she's either indifferent or ruthless regarding all those real people she's just using as props for her fantasy. I'd call that a story of how power corrupts.
Not sure where you're getting me saying it was justified. People act out in weird ways when they have been traumatized, often without meaning to or even realizing they are doing it. Wanda's ability to literally live her own truth gave a more interesting visual/narrative angle on what other movies portray by having characters snap at other people or just stare offscreen.
Fair enough. I was responding to you not reading it as a power corrupts story. It's certainly a story about trauma and grief, but Wanda's near limitless power permitted her to run roughshod over an entire town when, as far as we know, she could have created new people for her little utopia rather than act as she did. My mother was schizophrenic and created significant drama for my father and me, but she didn't have superpowers so the neighborhood was safe.
Post Reply