Whither the GOP? (post-Trump edition)

User avatar
Hugh Akston
Posts: 20189
Joined: 05 May 2010, 15:51
Location: Elev. 5280 ft

Re: Whither the GOP? (post-Trump edition)

Post by Hugh Akston »

Shem wrote: 10 Feb 2021, 16:55
But, he cautioned, it could also be the vocal “never Trump” reality simply coming into focus as Republicans finally took the step of changing their registration, even though they hadn’t supported the president and his party since 2016.
Why are so many people convinced this is Never-Trumpers leaving the party? It could just as easily be Dolchstoss Republicans leaving because they took Trump seriously when he said the only way he could lose is if the GOP let it happen.
There's no way to know how many people are changing their registration because the GOP went too far for Trump and how many changed their registration because the GOP didn't go too far enough. Just like there's no way to know how many people are saying it's one versus saying it's the other versus acknowledging the obvious reality that it's a mix of both.
"Is a Lulztopia the best we can hope for?!?" ~Taktix®
"Well if they're blaming libertarians again then things must be going back to normal." ~dbcooper
User avatar
Hugh Akston
Posts: 20189
Joined: 05 May 2010, 15:51
Location: Elev. 5280 ft

Re: Whither the GOP? (post-Trump edition)

Post by Hugh Akston »

Serious talk of a #nevertrump third party
The early stage discussions include former elected Republicans, former officials in the Republican administrations of Ronald Reagan, George H.W. Bush, George W. Bush and Trump, ex-Republican ambassadors and Republican strategists, the people involved say.

More than 120 of them held a Zoom call last Friday to discuss the breakaway group, which would run on a platform of “principled conservatism,” including adherence to the Constitution and the rule of law - ideas those involved say have been trashed by Trump.

The plan would be to run candidates in some races but also to endorse center-right candidates in others, be they Republicans, independents or Democrats, the people say.
Names under consideration for a new party include the Integrity Party and the Center Right Party. If it is decided instead to form a faction, one name under discussion is the Center Right Republicans.
"Is a Lulztopia the best we can hope for?!?" ~Taktix®
"Well if they're blaming libertarians again then things must be going back to normal." ~dbcooper
User avatar
Aresen
Posts: 17761
Joined: 26 Apr 2010, 20:18
Location: Great White Pacific Northwest

Re: Whither the GOP? (post-Trump edition)

Post by Aresen »

Hugh Akston wrote: 11 Feb 2021, 11:01 Serious talk of a #nevertrump third party
The early stage discussions include former elected Republicans, former officials in the Republican administrations of Ronald Reagan, George H.W. Bush, George W. Bush and Trump, ex-Republican ambassadors and Republican strategists, the people involved say.

More than 120 of them held a Zoom call last Friday to discuss the breakaway group, which would run on a platform of “principled conservatism,” including adherence to the Constitution and the rule of law - ideas those involved say have been trashed by Trump.

The plan would be to run candidates in some races but also to endorse center-right candidates in others, be they Republicans, independents or Democrats, the people say.
Names under consideration for a new party include the Integrity Party and the Center Right Party. If it is decided instead to form a faction, one name under discussion is the Center Right Republicans.
I thought there was a 'Conservative Party' legally registered in the US already. Why not join them?
If Trump supporters wanted a tough guy, why did they elect such a whiny bitch? - Mo

Those who know history are doomed to deja vu. - the innominate one

Never bring a knife to a joke fight" - dhex
User avatar
Kolohe
Posts: 14855
Joined: 06 May 2010, 10:51

Re: Whither the GOP? (post-Trump edition)

Post by Kolohe »

It will be serious when they have actual money behind them. They don’t.

Every poll shows that the vast majority of Republicans are Trump loyalists, some despite what he’s done since the Nov 3 election, others because of it.
when you wake up as the queen of the n=1 kingdom and mount your steed non sequiturius, do you look out upon all you survey and think “damn, it feels good to be a green idea sleeping furiously?" - dhex
User avatar
Hugh Akston
Posts: 20189
Joined: 05 May 2010, 15:51
Location: Elev. 5280 ft

Re: Whither the GOP? (post-Trump edition)

Post by Hugh Akston »

Aresen wrote: 11 Feb 2021, 11:45
Hugh Akston wrote: 11 Feb 2021, 11:01 Serious talk of a #nevertrump third party
The early stage discussions include former elected Republicans, former officials in the Republican administrations of Ronald Reagan, George H.W. Bush, George W. Bush and Trump, ex-Republican ambassadors and Republican strategists, the people involved say.

More than 120 of them held a Zoom call last Friday to discuss the breakaway group, which would run on a platform of “principled conservatism,” including adherence to the Constitution and the rule of law - ideas those involved say have been trashed by Trump.

The plan would be to run candidates in some races but also to endorse center-right candidates in others, be they Republicans, independents or Democrats, the people say.
Names under consideration for a new party include the Integrity Party and the Center Right Party. If it is decided instead to form a faction, one name under discussion is the Center Right Republicans.
I thought there was a 'Conservative Party' legally registered in the US already. Why not join them?
There has never been a national party to use the word Conservative.

The Conservative Party USA is a PAC at best, and they're blindly pro-Trump.
"Is a Lulztopia the best we can hope for?!?" ~Taktix®
"Well if they're blaming libertarians again then things must be going back to normal." ~dbcooper
User avatar
Jasper
Posts: 3560
Joined: 27 Apr 2010, 07:56
Location: Newyorkachusetts

Re: Whither the GOP? (post-Trump edition)

Post by Jasper »

Bring back the Whigs?
User avatar
Hugh Akston
Posts: 20189
Joined: 05 May 2010, 15:51
Location: Elev. 5280 ft

Re: Whither the GOP? (post-Trump edition)

Post by Hugh Akston »

Jasper wrote: 11 Feb 2021, 13:51 Bring back the Whigs?
Not a bad idea. One conservative party can call themselves the Whigs, the other can call themselves the Combovers.
"Is a Lulztopia the best we can hope for?!?" ~Taktix®
"Well if they're blaming libertarians again then things must be going back to normal." ~dbcooper
User avatar
thoreau
Posts: 31202
Joined: 06 May 2010, 12:56
Location: Back to the lab again

Re: Whither the GOP? (post-Trump edition)

Post by thoreau »

Jasper wrote: 11 Feb 2021, 13:51 Bring back the Whigs?
Mike Pence said that could be a real drag.
"...if that monkey gets any smarter it's going to start shorting TSLA."
--JD
User avatar
Jennifer
Posts: 26691
Joined: 28 Apr 2010, 14:03

Re: Whither the GOP? (post-Trump edition)

Post by Jennifer »

CPAC makes it pretty obvious: the GOP is now the Trumpist party. Even when he dies, his kids will take his place.
"Myself, despite what they say about libertarians, I think we're actually allowed to pursue options beyond futility or sucking the dicks of the powerful." -- Eric the .5b
User avatar
Aresen
Posts: 17761
Joined: 26 Apr 2010, 20:18
Location: Great White Pacific Northwest

Re: Whither the GOP? (post-Trump edition)

Post by Aresen »

Jennifer wrote: 01 Mar 2021, 11:08 CPAC makes it pretty obvious: the GOP is now the Trumpist party. Even when he dies, his kids will take his place.
Basically, but I don't think the kids can pull it off. They just don't have the swagger.
If Trump supporters wanted a tough guy, why did they elect such a whiny bitch? - Mo

Those who know history are doomed to deja vu. - the innominate one

Never bring a knife to a joke fight" - dhex
User avatar
Jennifer
Posts: 26691
Joined: 28 Apr 2010, 14:03

Re: Whither the GOP? (post-Trump edition)

Post by Jennifer »

Aresen wrote: 01 Mar 2021, 15:51
Jennifer wrote: 01 Mar 2021, 11:08 CPAC makes it pretty obvious: the GOP is now the Trumpist party. Even when he dies, his kids will take his place.
Basically, but I don't think the kids can pull it off. They just don't have the swagger.
They don't need swagger so long as they have Trump's name and sociopathy, and they do. (In fact, I suspect that once DJT dies the GOP will get even worse; they'll make him an icon.)
"Myself, despite what they say about libertarians, I think we're actually allowed to pursue options beyond futility or sucking the dicks of the powerful." -- Eric the .5b
User avatar
Kolohe
Posts: 14855
Joined: 06 May 2010, 10:51

Re: Whither the GOP? (post-Trump edition)

Post by Kolohe »

they don't have the 40 years of permeating the mainstream American consciousness.
when you wake up as the queen of the n=1 kingdom and mount your steed non sequiturius, do you look out upon all you survey and think “damn, it feels good to be a green idea sleeping furiously?" - dhex
User avatar
Jennifer
Posts: 26691
Joined: 28 Apr 2010, 14:03

Re: Whither the GOP? (post-Trump edition)

Post by Jennifer »

I don't think they'll need it, when they can piggyback off their dad. Especially since "owning the libz" remains the closest thing to an actual principle the GOP now has.
"Myself, despite what they say about libertarians, I think we're actually allowed to pursue options beyond futility or sucking the dicks of the powerful." -- Eric the .5b
User avatar
thoreau
Posts: 31202
Joined: 06 May 2010, 12:56
Location: Back to the lab again

Re: Whither the GOP? (post-Trump edition)

Post by thoreau »

Kolohe wrote: 01 Mar 2021, 18:17 they don't have the 40 years of permeating the mainstream American consciousness.
And however much his "self-made businessman" image is at odds with facts, he spent those decades selling the image. A lot of people still buy it. But that will be a much harder sell for his kids. Even W. had a not-insane case for a career separate from his father. The Trump kids are just so visibly entwined with their father's brand, whereas Donald Trump basically never appeared on camera with his father.
"...if that monkey gets any smarter it's going to start shorting TSLA."
--JD
User avatar
Jennifer
Posts: 26691
Joined: 28 Apr 2010, 14:03

Re: Whither the GOP? (post-Trump edition)

Post by Jennifer »

I hope you guys are right, but I fear you're giving the GOP too much credit for intelligence here; the fact that the Trump kids are so intertwined with their father's brand is precisely why I fear the GOP will remain the Trump party for the foreseeable future. Hardcore royalists never have a problem with letting the king's kids take his throne after he croaks.
"Myself, despite what they say about libertarians, I think we're actually allowed to pursue options beyond futility or sucking the dicks of the powerful." -- Eric the .5b
User avatar
Hugh Akston
Posts: 20189
Joined: 05 May 2010, 15:51
Location: Elev. 5280 ft

Re: Whither the GOP? (post-Trump edition)

Post by Hugh Akston »

Team Jennifer. Being entwined with the Trump brand can only help the kids. Facts and narrative are malleable so long as they are employed in the service of giving the knuckle-dragging base something to be mad at.
"Is a Lulztopia the best we can hope for?!?" ~Taktix®
"Well if they're blaming libertarians again then things must be going back to normal." ~dbcooper
User avatar
thoreau
Posts: 31202
Joined: 06 May 2010, 12:56
Location: Back to the lab again

Re: Whither the GOP? (post-Trump edition)

Post by thoreau »

If the question is whether the GOP could nominate a Trump offspring, yes, I think they could.

I also think that the only way the Democrats lose a general election for Presidency or Senate against a Trump offspring is if they nominate someone as polarizing as Hillary Clinton, so I would say...um, yeah, I guess they could fuck this up.

I will say that if the GOP loses a Senate race with a Trump in 2022, or a Senate or White House race with a Trump in 2024, we might finally see a purging of the Trump brand from the GOP. However, the deeper rot in the GOP will not be mitigated for a long time, if ever.
"...if that monkey gets any smarter it's going to start shorting TSLA."
--JD
User avatar
Jennifer
Posts: 26691
Joined: 28 Apr 2010, 14:03

Re: Whither the GOP? (post-Trump edition)

Post by Jennifer »

thoreau wrote: 01 Mar 2021, 18:45 If the question is whether the GOP could nominate a Trump offspring, yes, I think they could.

I also think that the only way the Democrats lose a general election for Presidency or Senate against a Trump offspring is if they nominate someone as polarizing as Hillary Clinton, so I would say...um, yeah, I guess they could fuck this up.
Are you forgetting the electoral college, and the GOP's new enthusiasm for passing voter-suppression laws?
"Myself, despite what they say about libertarians, I think we're actually allowed to pursue options beyond futility or sucking the dicks of the powerful." -- Eric the .5b
User avatar
Hugh Akston
Posts: 20189
Joined: 05 May 2010, 15:51
Location: Elev. 5280 ft

Re: Whither the GOP? (post-Trump edition)

Post by Hugh Akston »

Jennifer wrote: 01 Mar 2021, 18:46
thoreau wrote: 01 Mar 2021, 18:45 If the question is whether the GOP could nominate a Trump offspring, yes, I think they could.

I also think that the only way the Democrats lose a general election for Presidency or Senate against a Trump offspring is if they nominate someone as polarizing as Hillary Clinton, so I would say...um, yeah, I guess they could fuck this up.
Are you forgetting the electoral college, and the GOP's new enthusiasm for passing voter-suppression laws?
It's not new.

And T, never underestimate Team Blue's ability to find and run the weakest candidate possible.
"Is a Lulztopia the best we can hope for?!?" ~Taktix®
"Well if they're blaming libertarians again then things must be going back to normal." ~dbcooper
User avatar
Jennifer
Posts: 26691
Joined: 28 Apr 2010, 14:03

Re: Whither the GOP? (post-Trump edition)

Post by Jennifer »

Hugh Akston wrote: 01 Mar 2021, 18:49
Jennifer wrote: 01 Mar 2021, 18:46
thoreau wrote: 01 Mar 2021, 18:45 If the question is whether the GOP could nominate a Trump offspring, yes, I think they could.

I also think that the only way the Democrats lose a general election for Presidency or Senate against a Trump offspring is if they nominate someone as polarizing as Hillary Clinton, so I would say...um, yeah, I guess they could fuck this up.
Are you forgetting the electoral college, and the GOP's new enthusiasm for passing voter-suppression laws?
It's not new.

And T, never underestimate Team Blue's ability to find and run the weakest candidate possible.
No, it's not new, but they turned it up to 11 after this latest election. The Trumpitos won't need the majority of qualified voters to win elections, anymore than Trump himself did.
"Myself, despite what they say about libertarians, I think we're actually allowed to pursue options beyond futility or sucking the dicks of the powerful." -- Eric the .5b
User avatar
Aresen
Posts: 17761
Joined: 26 Apr 2010, 20:18
Location: Great White Pacific Northwest

Re: Whither the GOP? (post-Trump edition)

Post by Aresen »

Jennifer wrote: 01 Mar 2021, 18:46
thoreau wrote: 01 Mar 2021, 18:45 If the question is whether the GOP could nominate a Trump offspring, yes, I think they could.

I also think that the only way the Democrats lose a general election for Presidency or Senate against a Trump offspring is if they nominate someone as polarizing as Hillary Clinton, so I would say...um, yeah, I guess they could fuck this up.
Are you forgetting the electoral college, and the GOP's new enthusiasm for passing voter-suppression laws?
2016 & 2020 have made me gunshy of polls. I don't think the GOP will have a national plurality without a MAJOR Team Blue fuckup. (Like a 3 year recession, nominating AOC, making live LGBTQ demonstrations part of a complusory sex ed for grade schoolers, etc.) But, as Jennifer point out, they don't need a plurality. They just need enough knuckle-draggers in enough states plus some vigorous voter suppression.)
If Trump supporters wanted a tough guy, why did they elect such a whiny bitch? - Mo

Those who know history are doomed to deja vu. - the innominate one

Never bring a knife to a joke fight" - dhex
User avatar
D.A. Ridgely
Posts: 20972
Joined: 26 Apr 2010, 17:09
Location: The Other Side

Re: Whither the GOP? (post-Trump edition)

Post by D.A. Ridgely »

There won't be any Trump dynasty. Whatever comes next may be better, it may be worse, but it won't be that.
User avatar
thoreau
Posts: 31202
Joined: 06 May 2010, 12:56
Location: Back to the lab again

Re: Whither the GOP? (post-Trump edition)

Post by thoreau »

Hugh Akston wrote: 01 Mar 2021, 18:49
Jennifer wrote: 01 Mar 2021, 18:46
thoreau wrote: 01 Mar 2021, 18:45 If the question is whether the GOP could nominate a Trump offspring, yes, I think they could.

I also think that the only way the Democrats lose a general election for Presidency or Senate against a Trump offspring is if they nominate someone as polarizing as Hillary Clinton, so I would say...um, yeah, I guess they could fuck this up.
Are you forgetting the electoral college, and the GOP's new enthusiasm for passing voter-suppression laws?
It's not new.

And T, never underestimate Team Blue's ability to find and run the weakest candidate possible.
I don't.

I'll just say that if (big if) the Blues nominate someone decent, a critical mass of swing voters could defeat a Trump, even with the electoral college.

But, yeah, big if. Very big if.
"...if that monkey gets any smarter it's going to start shorting TSLA."
--JD
User avatar
Pham Nuwen
Posts: 9248
Joined: 27 Apr 2010, 02:17

Re: Whither the GOP? (post-Trump edition)

Post by Pham Nuwen »

The giant guy from Pennsylvania should be the nominee. Sorry but that guy flexes. And that speaks to the knuckledraggers. You can run aoc and all them after a 2 term giant guy. No one will remember Trump by then.
Goddamn libertarian message board. Hugh Akston

leave me to my mescaline smoothie in peace, please. dhex
User avatar
Shem
Posts: 8854
Joined: 27 Apr 2010, 00:27

Re: Whither the GOP? (post-Trump edition)

Post by Shem »

Gonna be hard for the Trump kids to run for anything after their dad sets them up to take the fall for all the shady shit he's been doing since...well, "always." There's a half dozen jurisdictions full of prosecutors who want to build a career on being The Man Who Shot Liberty Valance, and Trump's going to sell the German techno band he calls his offspring on taking the fall with promises of pardons that'll never actually materialize.
"VOTE SHEMOCRACY! You will only have to do it once!" -Loyalty Officer Aresen
Post Reply