Video Games!

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Jasper
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Re: Video Games!

Post by Jasper » 15 Jan 2019, 14:50

I admit I gave up on Pathfinder for pretty much the reason Jason says. There's another encounter along the main story line where you run across a weird bear-ent hybrid thing... same story; critter one-shots everyone in the party.

The camping mechanic is kinda cool, but is really poorly done. Yeah, it only works outdoors. "You've spent 17 hours hunting for your party" thing is nuts. Found a bag of rice in that bandit camp; too bad you don't have a recipe to cook it. FFS.
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JasonL
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Re: Video Games!

Post by JasonL » 15 Jan 2019, 15:13

Having played ADD of various flavors but not Pathfinder per se - I was not prepared for how powerful everything gets very quickly.

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Ellie
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Re: Video Games!

Post by Ellie » 24 Jan 2019, 03:36

Dangerman wrote:
14 Jan 2019, 21:35
It really bums me out that the word "turret" appears in a Diablo game. :(
Why is that? (I know nothing about Diablo games but your post has me so intrigued!)
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Dangerman
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Re: Video Games!

Post by Dangerman » 24 Jan 2019, 13:03

Ellie wrote:
24 Jan 2019, 03:36
Dangerman wrote:
14 Jan 2019, 21:35
It really bums me out that the word "turret" appears in a Diablo game. :(
Why is that? (I know nothing about Diablo games but your post has me so intrigued!)
It reduces the context to pure game mechanics that removes the small vestige of plot and setting in order to make it just like every other game you can play.

The games (I, II, and now III) are set in a medieval context, it's swords and sorcery. You don't pick up 'first aid kits', you visit a Shrine of Health, for instance. Except now in the third installment, any limits inside that setting are discarded. You can get a crossbow that shoots at machine gun speeds, and instead of having, for example, 'an orb of fire' that launches attacks on its own, they call it a 'turret'. Except none of the characters or interior structure would understand why a 'turret' would refer to that and not a part of a castle fortification. It's like if you had a story in which a Knight Templar refers to himself, in dialog, as a 'tank', which is a concept that the 21st century player or reader would instantly understand, but is wholly inappropriate for the interior text to include.

The setting has been devalued because the developers wanted to game to be so approachable that anything outside the players existing experience cannot be allowed.

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dead_elvis
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Re: Video Games!

Post by dead_elvis » 14 May 2019, 13:33

Playing FIFA circa 2000:

pay money/read instructions/put in disc/play game

*attempting* to play FIFA in 2019:

Download,install/launch/update app/sign up for an account/go through a bunch of training up bullshit/customize my "ultimate team"/unlock team packs/good god what is all this garbage on my screen/collect gems/unlock quests WTF are you kidding me?/trade gems for more points for more training whatevs I give up what does any of this have to do with either sports or video games

You used to be able to go from unwrapping to being Costa Rica playing against France within about 5-10 minutes. I've probably spent hours on this app and have yet to figure out how to even play a complete match.

Madden NFL was the same crap. I'm happy to settle for decades-behind-state-of-the-art-experience on my phone, I'm not asking for the moon here, but I just want to be able to 1) buy a game and 2) just play a normal game with it without all the extra garbage always trying to get up in my business.
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Dangerman
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Re: Video Games!

Post by Dangerman » 14 May 2019, 15:16

That's because FIFA is now a 'Live Service', not a game. It's so pernicious that the EU has banned a bunch of microtransaction and gambling/loot box features in the new FIFA series.

Sorry to tell you this, man. This has been happening all over the AAA game space. It's almost impossible to just buy a big name game title and get what you paid for, you're almost certainly going to be locked into a bunch of bullshit like unique accounts via a publisher-specific launcher, having to grind for features that were previously baked-in, etc.

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lunchstealer
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Re: Video Games!

Post by lunchstealer » 14 May 2019, 15:40

Dangerman wrote:
14 May 2019, 15:16
That's because FIFA is now a 'Live Service', not a game. It's so pernicious that the EU has banned a bunch of microtransaction and gambling/loot box features in the new FIFA series.

Sorry to tell you this, man. This has been happening all over the AAA game space. It's almost impossible to just buy a big name game title and get what you paid for, you're almost certainly going to be locked into a bunch of bullshit like unique accounts via a publisher-specific launcher, having to grind for features that were previously baked-in, etc.
Yeah, I assume that it's all Farmville-style 'you can do a bunch of complete bullshit or just pay $.99 to get this one feature right away, now you can do a bunch of complete bullshit to get the next feature or you can pay $.99 to get this next feature right away' type shit?
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nicole
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Re: Video Games!

Post by nicole » 14 May 2019, 15:53

Dangerman wrote:
14 May 2019, 15:16
That's because FIFA is now a 'Live Service', not a game. It's so pernicious that the EU has banned a bunch of microtransaction and gambling/loot box features in the new FIFA series.

Sorry to tell you this, man. This has been happening all over the AAA game space. It's almost impossible to just buy a big name game title and get what you paid for, you're almost certainly going to be locked into a bunch of bullshit like unique accounts via a publisher-specific launcher, having to grind for features that were previously baked-in, etc.
And you're lucky if the next update to your favorite AAA title even has a single player mode.
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JasonL
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Re: Video Games!

Post by JasonL » 14 May 2019, 16:15

I have high hopes for Team Witcher doing Cyberpunk.

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JD
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Re: Video Games!

Post by JD » 14 May 2019, 16:26

I am amused by "Crowd City" on my phone. It feels like a beta version/mechanism for getting you to watch ads* but it's still fun. You start out as one faceless, brightly colored cartoon guy running around a SimCity-style city. You are apparently the most charismatic person ever, because as soon as you run by a random gray pedestrian, they turn your color and start running along with you. Rinse & repeat, and you have an ever-growing mob. Of course, other mobs are trying to do exactly the same thing. When two mobs collide, generally the bigger one eats the smaller (although occasionally a smaller mob manages to nibble at the edges of a bigger one). There is not much else to do or even customize beyond different skins, so you can run around the city as a horde of pigs, or snakes, or football players, or whatever.

* Matches are on a timer and last two minutes (I think), at the end of which you are shown an unquittable video ad. However, if you are OK with turning data off during your session, the ads never load...
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Eric the .5b
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Re: Video Games!

Post by Eric the .5b » 14 May 2019, 21:21

It's been fun playing City of Heroes/City of Villains again on Homecoming. Holy crap, they added a lot of powers and customization options, either after I'd drifted away or in that beta update that never went live before they shut down.

No telling how long this lasts before it gets shut down, but hey.

(Mercy Island is still an ugly-ass place that's a pain to navigate around...)
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Ellie
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Re: Video Games!

Post by Ellie » 15 May 2019, 11:24

JD wrote:
14 May 2019, 16:26
I am amused by "Crowd City" on my phone. It feels like a beta version/mechanism for getting you to watch ads* but it's still fun. You start out as one faceless, brightly colored cartoon guy running around a SimCity-style city. You are apparently the most charismatic person ever, because as soon as you run by a random gray pedestrian, they turn your color and start running along with you. Rinse & repeat, and you have an ever-growing mob. Of course, other mobs are trying to do exactly the same thing. When two mobs collide, generally the bigger one eats the smaller (although occasionally a smaller mob manages to nibble at the edges of a bigger one). There is not much else to do or even customize beyond different skins, so you can run around the city as a horde of pigs, or snakes, or football players, or whatever.

* Matches are on a timer and last two minutes (I think), at the end of which you are shown an unquittable video ad. However, if you are OK with turning data off during your session, the ads never load...
This sounds cute; I'm going to show it to Modspawn! He's very into .io games at the moment (superhex.io, pacman.io, etc) and this sounds like a similar concept, but with cute little running people.
"He's just an idiot elected by idiots." - Pham

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dead_elvis
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Re: Video Games!

Post by dead_elvis » 15 May 2019, 14:56

lunchstealer wrote:
14 May 2019, 15:40
Dangerman wrote:
14 May 2019, 15:16
That's because FIFA is now a 'Live Service', not a game. It's so pernicious that the EU has banned a bunch of microtransaction and gambling/loot box features in the new FIFA series.

Sorry to tell you this, man. This has been happening all over the AAA game space. It's almost impossible to just buy a big name game title and get what you paid for, you're almost certainly going to be locked into a bunch of bullshit like unique accounts via a publisher-specific launcher, having to grind for features that were previously baked-in, etc.
Yeah, I assume that it's all Farmville-style 'you can do a bunch of complete bullshit or just pay $.99 to get this one feature right away, now you can do a bunch of complete bullshit to get the next feature or you can pay $.99 to get this next feature right away' type shit?
That's the thing- while I was expecting this, to be nagged about buying little bullshit to get ahead, I'm so confused by the interface that I'm not sure what I'm supposed to be doing. Like being casual about gaming (last major title I've played anyone would recognize is Portal) means I'm Rip Van Winkle and the conventions that they assume I know are based on these "gem" collecting and leveling up games, not from the old sports games. After discovering gems and quests in my goddamn soccer I'm half convinced they didn't even fork this from previous FIFA, they took a generic adventure game and put soccer skins over it. I guess I'm resentful that I purposely avoided these sorts of game mechanics because they were obviously shitty but now I'm being punished for never learning how they work.
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Eric the .5b
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Re: Video Games!

Post by Eric the .5b » 15 May 2019, 16:34

This is where I don't turn in my decoder ring:

Image

You're damn adults, so shut up and parent. Don't let your kids buy loot boxes. Don't let them buy games with the possibility of loot boxes, if need be.
"Better that ten guilty persons escape than that one innocent suffer."
Cet animal est très méchant / Quand on l'attaque il se défend.

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Painboy
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Re: Video Games!

Post by Painboy » 15 May 2019, 18:57

Eric the .5b wrote:
15 May 2019, 16:34
This is where I don't turn in my decoder ring:

Image

You're damn adults, so shut up and parent. Don't let your kids buy loot boxes. Don't let them buy games with the possibility of loot boxes, if need be.
It's also is an attitude that doesn't even consider that some people like that kind of thing. I personally don't care for it but for some it produces a great deal of excitement.

Additionally I hate the conflation of loot boxes and gambling. You can't win money, or anything you can exchange for money. They're basically carnival prizes, except you might actually get something worthwhile.

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Dangerman
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Re: Video Games!

Post by Dangerman » 15 May 2019, 20:09

"Something worthwhile" is equivalent in this case to "something users would pay money for". Because it's a digital good, and thus scarcity is controlled, you can't really sell it for money, but if you could, you would have ready buyers. I think it's absolutely gambling.

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Highway
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Re: Video Games!

Post by Highway » 15 May 2019, 20:43

Yeah, I'm in the 'gambling' camp as well, since it's a *chance* to get the valuable thing, not just buying it. If they just sold it, that's one thing you can complain about if you want (plenty of people complain about the Blizzard store for WoW). But selling gacha / loot boxes just adds another layer of "screw you, give us more money" to it. It's a lottery, and lotteries are pretty much exactly gambling.
"Sharks do not go around challenging people to games of chance like dojo breakers."

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Painboy
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Re: Video Games!

Post by Painboy » 15 May 2019, 21:54

You cannot win your money back that you spend. By definition that is not gambling. In a lottery it is possible to spend money on a chance to win more money. You cannot do that with loot boxes.

Also if loot boxes are gambling then so are every collectible card game from Pokemon to Magic. Especially as you can exchange many of the rare cards for real money.

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Dangerman
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Re: Video Games!

Post by Dangerman » 15 May 2019, 22:29

There are games where you can convert the items to actual money via trade. Most of them do poorly because of the problems inherent to a centralized economy, but they exist. I don't think you actually addressed my point though, that clearly people do value them as they would value something that could be bought with money, and as something that has monetary value.

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Highway
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Re: Video Games!

Post by Highway » 15 May 2019, 22:48

Painboy wrote:
15 May 2019, 21:54
You cannot win your money back that you spend. By definition that is not gambling. In a lottery it is possible to spend money on a chance to win more money. You cannot do that with loot boxes.

Also if loot boxes are gambling then so are every collectible card game from Pokemon to Magic. Especially as you can exchange many of the rare cards for real money.
How is that the only definition of 'gambling'? Every definition I see says "money or other stakes / items of value". It's undeniable that the desired items are valuable to the people who play it.
"Sharks do not go around challenging people to games of chance like dojo breakers."

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Pham Nuwen
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Re: Video Games!

Post by Pham Nuwen » 15 May 2019, 23:04

My 2 cents are useless as I have no data to support my opinion.

And my opinion is that loot boxes are stupid and for stupid people.

But if you want to argue that kids don't need these kinds of dopamine inducing rigamaroles ... well ... you kind of have my attention a bit to your argument. I can see a public issue there. Mainly because of the age/consent issue I see could arise there. I think we all agree kids are stupid and need a little bit of time to understand how things work. Especially the predatory ones.

But if your argument is that it's gambling pure and simple and that's wrong ... well you can go fuck yourself. Also should probably learn to enjoy life a bit. Maybe have sex occasionally with the lights on or maybe have contact with other people beyond birthdays and such. You know. A vice is a vice and that's kind of what makes us human a bit.

I see a lot of arguments blend together my two points and that makes me unhappy. Followed by me shrugging and moving on with my day.

That is all.
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dead_elvis
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Re: Video Games!

Post by dead_elvis » 15 May 2019, 23:05

Eric the .5b wrote:
15 May 2019, 16:34
This is where I don't turn in my decoder ring:
And here I was being an *excellent* consumer. Which got me bupkis.
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Highway
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Re: Video Games!

Post by Highway » 16 May 2019, 00:11

I don't think it's bad practice *because* it's gambling. I think it's bad practice because I don't like it, and don't like seeing people induced to pay for a *chance* to get something, compared to just having a store that you can buy the items in. I get that it's a moneymaker for game producers, but that doesn't help me like it any better. I'm completely on board with the "don't let your kids play gacha / buy lootboxes" thing because they don't really get all the factors involved.
"Sharks do not go around challenging people to games of chance like dojo breakers."

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lunchstealer
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Video Games!

Post by lunchstealer » 16 May 2019, 00:35

If it’s gambling then so are baseball card packs.

This is not necessarily an argument that it’s not gambling.
"The constitution is more of a BDSM agreement with a safe word." - Sandy

"Neoliberalism. Austerity. Booga booga!!!!" - JasonL

"We can't confirm rumors that Lynndie England is in the running to be Gina Haspel's personal aide." - DAR

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Shem
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Re: Video Games!

Post by Shem » 16 May 2019, 00:45

JasonL, have you seen this?



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