The Not-So- and All-Too-Real World of North Korea

User avatar
Aresen
Posts: 14347
Joined: 26 Apr 2010, 20:18
Location: Great White Pacific Northwest

Re: The Not-So- and All-Too-Real World of North Korea

Post by Aresen » 09 Aug 2017, 22:20

Fin Fang Foom wrote:
09 Aug 2017, 22:13
Jennifer wrote:
09 Aug 2017, 21:59
By now, everyone who pays attention knows he has nukes; he has nothing more to gain (but quite a bit to lose) by continuing missile tests which even China has told him to quit.

It's like, you already know I have a gun and ammo, plus the willingness to use it; periodically shooting out of my window is not going to increase my personal safety, but might very well piss off enough people to make my personal situation worse.
It isn't expected that he will be able to mount a warheads on a ballistic missile until 2018. The minaturization will take the bombs from UPS truck-sized to porto-potty or smaller, small enough to put on a missile.
So, you expect him to get his shit together.
*runs*
If Trump supporters wanted a tough guy, why did they elect such a whiny bitch? - Mo

Those who know history are doomed to deja vu. - the innominate one

Never bring a knife to a joke fight" - dhex

User avatar
Fin Fang Foom
Posts: 9539
Joined: 05 May 2010, 22:39

Re: The Not-So- and All-Too-Real World of North Korea

Post by Fin Fang Foom » 09 Aug 2017, 22:23

No Aresen, if he gets his shit together, we will all have the runs.

User avatar
Jennifer
Posts: 22506
Joined: 28 Apr 2010, 14:03

Re: The Not-So- and All-Too-Real World of North Korea

Post by Jennifer » 09 Aug 2017, 22:25

Damn, I wish we had ANYBODY other than Trump in the White House right now. Even Pence would be an improvement -- there's at least the hypothetical possibility he'd talk to actual competent advisers about this mess, rather than surround himself with toadying flatterers.
"Myself, despite what they say about libertarians, I think we're actually allowed to pursue options beyond futility or sucking the dicks of the powerful." -- Eric the .5b

User avatar
Aresen
Posts: 14347
Joined: 26 Apr 2010, 20:18
Location: Great White Pacific Northwest

Re: The Not-So- and All-Too-Real World of North Korea

Post by Aresen » 09 Aug 2017, 22:32

Jennifer wrote:
09 Aug 2017, 22:25
Damn, I wish we had ANYBODY other than Trump in the White House right now. Even Pence would be an improvement -- there's at least the hypothetical possibility he'd talk to actual competent advisers about this mess, rather than surround himself with toadying flatterers.
Myocardial infarction is our friend.
If Trump supporters wanted a tough guy, why did they elect such a whiny bitch? - Mo

Those who know history are doomed to deja vu. - the innominate one

Never bring a knife to a joke fight" - dhex

User avatar
fyodor
Posts: 6832
Joined: 05 May 2010, 17:18

Re: The Not-So- and All-Too-Real World of North Korea

Post by fyodor » 09 Aug 2017, 23:05

Jennifer wrote:
09 Aug 2017, 21:52
This is a Longshot for Kim, but it's kinda like Robert Deniro's last round of Russian Roulette in the Deer Hunter: better than the 100% chance of dying.
I haven't seen the Deer Hunter and thus don't get that specific analogy, but: even with the orange man-child in the White House, Kim only faces that "100% chance of dying" if he does something stupid like attack a US missile base. If all he wants to do is continue being the scumbag dictator of a shithole, his best bet is to STOP behaving in ways so awful
Yeah from where I sit, that seems fairly obvious, that the best thing for him to do is to relax and do nothing and he gets to keep being the scumbag dictator of a shithole. Maybe from where Un sits, it looks Shemian and Foomian and he's thinks he's sure to get invaded by the US and deposed if he isn't as aggro as possible towards the US at each and every turn? But it sure seems crazy from here. Which I guess is Lunchie's point, and maybe a foregone conclusion. But, well, yeah, I guess that's what it is..... (Though Shem's point seems to be that it's the perfectly rational way to look at it?)
Your optimism just confuses and enrages me. - Timothy

User avatar
Sandy
Posts: 9984
Joined: 26 Apr 2010, 18:03
Location: In the hearts of little children, clogging their arteries.

Re: The Not-So- and All-Too-Real World of North Korea

Post by Sandy » 09 Aug 2017, 23:49

thoreau wrote:
09 Aug 2017, 12:42
Nobody truly abandons a nuke program, but some programs run as back-burner insurance policies while others run as high-priority initiatives. One of these things is less bad than the other.
Not quite true. AFAIK, there is no evidence of a Brazilian or South African nuclear program anymore, though both had active ones. Taiwan supposedly did, too, but I'd be mildly shocked if there weren't at least plans around. And while Japan theoretically never had one, the consensus used to be that they could assemble one in a couple of months, mostly from spare parts strategically left lying around various public safety locations.
Hindu is the cricket of religions. You can observe it for years, you can have enthusiasts try to explain it to you, and it's still baffling. - Warren

User avatar
Shem
Posts: 7126
Joined: 27 Apr 2010, 00:27

Re: The Not-So- and All-Too-Real World of North Korea

Post by Shem » 10 Aug 2017, 01:43

Any country with a self-sufficient nuclear power system has the hardest part of getting a nuke. That's why Europe and the US are so eager to provide "technical assistance" to anyone who wants to build a nuclear plant. They give you the fuel on the cheap so you have no excuse to make your own, and you can't start making a little more, just to have sitting around in case you decide to help Junior make a hydrogen bomb for his science fair.
"VOTE SHEMOCRACY! You will only have to do it once!" -Loyalty Officer Aresen

User avatar
thoreau
Posts: 26126
Joined: 06 May 2010, 12:56
Location: Back to the lab again

Re: The Not-So- and All-Too-Real World of North Korea

Post by thoreau » 10 Aug 2017, 01:49

Not to mention that "technical assistance" means that your technical people get to talk to their technical people. You can get a sense of whether people are only doing what they say they're doing or have other projects going on. Not a perfect intelligence-gathering approach, of course, but still a useful item in the toolkit.
"ike Wile E. Coyote salivating over a "4000 Ways To Prepare Roadrunner" cookbook without watching his surroundings, the Road Runner of Societal Inertia snuck up on them both and beepbeeped them off the mesa."
--Shem

User avatar
JasonL
Posts: 22447
Joined: 05 May 2010, 17:22

The Not-So- and All-Too-Real World of North Korea

Post by JasonL » 10 Aug 2017, 08:29

The bargain for no nukes can work if the goal of the potential nuke state include integration into markets and normalization of behavior. If you are in the Hobbes club though - you have all national wealth as personal wealth. You have no interest in foreign influence or cessation of murderous thuggery. There's nothing anyone can give you that's better than a nuke.

User avatar
fyodor
Posts: 6832
Joined: 05 May 2010, 17:18

Re: The Not-So- and All-Too-Real World of North Korea

Post by fyodor » 10 Aug 2017, 08:50

Somebody explain Hobbes club?
Your optimism just confuses and enrages me. - Timothy

User avatar
JasonL
Posts: 22447
Joined: 05 May 2010, 17:22

Re: The Not-So- and All-Too-Real World of North Korea

Post by JasonL » 10 Aug 2017, 08:52

Shem's characterization of that special group of nightmare tyrants like Un and Saddam.

User avatar
Taktix®
Posts: 7741
Joined: 07 May 2010, 05:29
Location: The Caribbean

Re: The Not-So- and All-Too-Real World of North Korea

Post by Taktix® » 10 Aug 2017, 09:15

fyodor wrote:
10 Aug 2017, 08:50
Somebody explain Hobbes club?
Leaders who believe their nation is just one agent engaged in Bellum omnium contra omnes, a.k.a. when you ran out of fucks like 400 years ago...
"Guilty as charged. Go ahead and ban me from the mall." - Ellie

User avatar
nicole
Posts: 8929
Joined: 12 Jan 2013, 16:28

Re: The Not-So- and All-Too-Real World of North Korea

Post by nicole » 10 Aug 2017, 09:42

Dude's surname is Kim guys.
"Fucking qualia." -Hugh Akston

"This is why I carry a shoehorn.” -jadagul

User avatar
Taktix®
Posts: 7741
Joined: 07 May 2010, 05:29
Location: The Caribbean

Re: The Not-So- and All-Too-Real World of North Korea

Post by Taktix® » 10 Aug 2017, 09:47

nicole wrote:
10 Aug 2017, 09:42
Dude's surname is Kim guys.
Yep, it's reversed in East Asia...
"Guilty as charged. Go ahead and ban me from the mall." - Ellie

User avatar
Aresen
Posts: 14347
Joined: 26 Apr 2010, 20:18
Location: Great White Pacific Northwest

Re: The Not-So- and All-Too-Real World of North Korea

Post by Aresen » 10 Aug 2017, 10:12

Taktix® wrote:
10 Aug 2017, 09:47
nicole wrote:
10 Aug 2017, 09:42
Dude's surname is Kim guys.
Yep, it's reversed in East Asia...
And in schools, universities, military, motor vehicle offices....
If Trump supporters wanted a tough guy, why did they elect such a whiny bitch? - Mo

Those who know history are doomed to deja vu. - the innominate one

Never bring a knife to a joke fight" - dhex

User avatar
Kolohe
Posts: 13365
Joined: 06 May 2010, 10:51

Re: The Not-So- and All-Too-Real World of North Korea

Post by Kolohe » 10 Aug 2017, 20:35

Taktix® wrote:
10 Aug 2017, 09:47
nicole wrote:
10 Aug 2017, 09:42
Dude's surname is Kim guys.
Yep, it's reversed in East Asia...
He's a Mik? No wonder he wants to fight the world.
when you wake up as the queen of the n=1 kingdom and mount your steed non sequiturius, do you look out upon all you survey and think “damn, it feels good to be a green idea sleeping furiously?" - dhex

User avatar
Hugh Akston
Posts: 17138
Joined: 05 May 2010, 15:51
Location: El Pueblo de Nuestra Señora Reina de los Angeles

Re: The Not-So- and All-Too-Real World of North Korea

Post by Hugh Akston » 15 Aug 2017, 17:41

"Is a Lulztopia the best we can hope for?!?" ~Taktix®
"Inexplicably cockfighting monsters that live in your pants" ~Jadagul

User avatar
fyodor
Posts: 6832
Joined: 05 May 2010, 17:18

Re: The Not-So- and All-Too-Real World of North Korea

Post by fyodor » 28 Aug 2017, 18:08

Um...

Damn how do you paste on a phone?

NK missile fired over Japan...
Your optimism just confuses and enrages me. - Timothy

User avatar
Kolohe
Posts: 13365
Joined: 06 May 2010, 10:51

Re: The Not-So- and All-Too-Real World of North Korea

Post by Kolohe » 28 Aug 2017, 18:13

Over Japan?
when you wake up as the queen of the n=1 kingdom and mount your steed non sequiturius, do you look out upon all you survey and think “damn, it feels good to be a green idea sleeping furiously?" - dhex

User avatar
fyodor
Posts: 6832
Joined: 05 May 2010, 17:18

Re: The Not-So- and All-Too-Real World of North Korea

Post by fyodor » 28 Aug 2017, 20:52

Kolohe wrote:
28 Aug 2017, 18:13
Over Japan?
Yeah.

Surprised there's not more buzz about it. Seems like quite the provocation/escalation. Though I guess as long as they aim to miss it may be considered just more chest thumping? Friend in Japan was reporting alarms going off over it....
Your optimism just confuses and enrages me. - Timothy

User avatar
Mo
Posts: 22828
Joined: 26 Apr 2010, 17:08

Re: The Not-So- and All-Too-Real World of North Korea

Post by Mo » 28 Aug 2017, 20:57

Bombs over Japan is the worst NK Outkast cover yet.
his voice is so soothing, but why do conspiracy nuts always sound like Batman and Robin solving one of Riddler's puzzles out loud? - fod

no one ever yells worldstar when a pet gets fucked up - dhex

User avatar
Ellie
Posts: 11281
Joined: 21 Apr 2010, 18:34

Re: The Not-So- and All-Too-Real World of North Korea

Post by Ellie » 29 Aug 2017, 09:22

It's getting low ratings due to the hurricane.
"NB stands for nota bene do not @ me" - nicole

User avatar
JasonL
Posts: 22447
Joined: 05 May 2010, 17:22

Re: The Not-So- and All-Too-Real World of North Korea

Post by JasonL » 29 Aug 2017, 10:04

I wonder if we will get to a stable state of nobody believes his missiles mean anything. He's doing this often enough it's normal.

User avatar
nicole
Posts: 8929
Joined: 12 Jan 2013, 16:28

Re: The Not-So- and All-Too-Real World of North Korea

Post by nicole » 29 Aug 2017, 10:09

Of course we will. I mean what else are we going to do.
"Fucking qualia." -Hugh Akston

"This is why I carry a shoehorn.” -jadagul

User avatar
JasonL
Posts: 22447
Joined: 05 May 2010, 17:22

Re: The Not-So- and All-Too-Real World of North Korea

Post by JasonL » 29 Aug 2017, 10:24

I guess I meant relatively sooner than we'd have thought. Like if you think marginal steps of escalation are supped to buy you something in the way of bargaining, but you've already launched so many missiles nobody reacts, the marginal bargaining power of each launch may be quickly decreasing.

Post Reply

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 6 guests