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dbcooper
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Re: Twitter!

Post by dbcooper » 26 Nov 2019, 12:10

Jasper wrote:
26 Nov 2019, 11:25
I first read about p-zeds not too long ago in the Corporation Wars trilogy by Ken MacLeod.
Did you finish those? I liked the first one, but got a bit bored during the second and gave up.
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Re: Twitter!

Post by JD » 26 Nov 2019, 12:24

Jasper wrote:
26 Nov 2019, 11:25
In trying to write this out, it occurs that I'm doing a terrible job, and that there's perhaps a super-subtle difference between what makes a p-zed and the trope of self-conscious robots or AIs. Maybe it comes down to forethought and anticipating future events. The p-zeds were always reactionary; they needed stimulus to react.
Yeah, while there are different kinds of philosophical zombies, I think the general common thread is that they act indistinguishably from beings that we agree are conscious (i.e., "real people"). If it acts differently, then it isn't quite the same thing. Philosophical zombies act just like you and me, and you can't test them to find the difference, but they are just missing some ineffable juju, which makes them "not real".
I sort of feel like a sucker about aspiring to be intellectually rigorous when I could just go on twitter and say capitalism causes space herpes and no one will challenge me on it. - Hugh Akston

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Re: Twitter!

Post by Jasper » 26 Nov 2019, 12:57

dbcooper wrote:
26 Nov 2019, 12:10
Jasper wrote:
26 Nov 2019, 11:25
I first read about p-zeds not too long ago in the Corporation Wars trilogy by Ken MacLeod.
Did you finish those? I liked the first one, but got a bit bored during the second and gave up.
Yeah, I did, and enjoyed them, but will agree that as he introduces more characters & factions, it seemed to drag in spots. I was also slightly underwhelmed with the way it wrapped up and the epilogue. He's not the wordsmith Banks was, and I found myself noticing it, but it's good enough.
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dbcooper
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Re: Twitter!

Post by dbcooper » 26 Nov 2019, 13:01

Jasper wrote:
26 Nov 2019, 12:57
dbcooper wrote:
26 Nov 2019, 12:10
Jasper wrote:
26 Nov 2019, 11:25
I first read about p-zeds not too long ago in the Corporation Wars trilogy by Ken MacLeod.
Did you finish those? I liked the first one, but got a bit bored during the second and gave up.
Yeah, I did, and enjoyed them, but will agree that as he introduces more characters & factions, it seemed to drag in spots. I was also slightly underwhelmed with the way it wrapped up and the epilogue. He's not the wordsmith Banks was, and I found myself noticing it, but it's good enough.
Thanks for the summary. I'll probably finish the series. The bit where they went into a medieval VR game, in the 2nd book, was where I lost interest. Needed a stricter editor. Interesting ideas though, especially space colonisation by smart-contract.
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Re: Twitter!

Post by Jasper » 26 Nov 2019, 15:03

dbcooper wrote:
26 Nov 2019, 13:01
Jasper wrote:
26 Nov 2019, 12:57
dbcooper wrote:
26 Nov 2019, 12:10
Jasper wrote:
26 Nov 2019, 11:25
I first read about p-zeds not too long ago in the Corporation Wars trilogy by Ken MacLeod.
Did you finish those? I liked the first one, but got a bit bored during the second and gave up.
Yeah, I did, and enjoyed them, but will agree that as he introduces more characters & factions, it seemed to drag in spots. I was also slightly underwhelmed with the way it wrapped up and the epilogue. He's not the wordsmith Banks was, and I found myself noticing it, but it's good enough.
Thanks for the summary. I'll probably finish the series. The bit where they went into a medieval VR game, in the 2nd book, was where I lost interest. Needed a stricter editor. Interesting ideas though, especially space colonisation by smart-contract.
Ha, that part was pretty wtf? Sure, it's a sim where you hang out in down time, but really? I mean, I can maybe buy into the medieval setting as your R&R base, but they had monsters and other fantasy trappings that was just jarring.

Although - there is a part later within that sim that is a turning point for Carlos.
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Re: Twitter!

Post by Eric the .5b » 26 Nov 2019, 21:26

JD wrote:
26 Nov 2019, 12:24
Jasper wrote:
26 Nov 2019, 11:25
In trying to write this out, it occurs that I'm doing a terrible job, and that there's perhaps a super-subtle difference between what makes a p-zed and the trope of self-conscious robots or AIs. Maybe it comes down to forethought and anticipating future events. The p-zeds were always reactionary; they needed stimulus to react.
Yeah, while there are different kinds of philosophical zombies, I think the general common thread is that they act indistinguishably from beings that we agree are conscious (i.e., "real people"). If it acts differently, then it isn't quite the same thing. Philosophical zombies act just like you and me, and you can't test them to find the difference, but they are just missing some ineffable juju, which makes them "not real".
Yeah. Which would suggest that a true temporary-p-zombie pill wouldn't appear to have any effect to you whatsoever. You'd remember everything p-zombie!you did as if you did it, you'd remember every thought or emotional reaction you would have otherwise remembered, including wondering if you were supposed to feel any different as a p-zombie.

(Which suggests the clinical trials would be underwhelming. "Indistinguishable from placebo, and in fact we lost track which was the placebo...")
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Re: Twitter!

Post by Jasper » 27 Nov 2019, 08:43

Eric the .5b wrote:
26 Nov 2019, 21:26
JD wrote:
26 Nov 2019, 12:24
Jasper wrote:
26 Nov 2019, 11:25
In trying to write this out, it occurs that I'm doing a terrible job, and that there's perhaps a super-subtle difference between what makes a p-zed and the trope of self-conscious robots or AIs. Maybe it comes down to forethought and anticipating future events. The p-zeds were always reactionary; they needed stimulus to react.
Yeah, while there are different kinds of philosophical zombies, I think the general common thread is that they act indistinguishably from beings that we agree are conscious (i.e., "real people"). If it acts differently, then it isn't quite the same thing. Philosophical zombies act just like you and me, and you can't test them to find the difference, but they are just missing some ineffable juju, which makes them "not real".
Yeah. Which would suggest that a true temporary-p-zombie pill wouldn't appear to have any effect to you whatsoever. You'd remember everything p-zombie!you did as if you did it, you'd remember every thought or emotional reaction you would have otherwise remembered, including wondering if you were supposed to feel any different as a p-zombie.

(Which suggests the clinical trials would be underwhelming. "Indistinguishable from placebo, and in fact we lost track which was the placebo...")
It sounds like the OP poll was essentially 'Would you like to be on general anesthesia for 8 hours at a time, but when you woke up, you'd remember everything?"

Which admittedly, as a dabbler in commerce, sounds intriguing.

Combine it with molly and speed and live out a self-imposed Huxley fever dream.
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Re: Twitter!

Post by JD » 27 Nov 2019, 10:10

Jasper wrote:
27 Nov 2019, 08:43
It sounds like the OP poll was essentially 'Would you like to be on general anesthesia for 8 hours at a time, but when you woke up, you'd remember everything?"

Which admittedly, as a dabbler in commerce, sounds intriguing.

Combine it with molly and speed and live out a self-imposed Huxley fever dream.
But if it's "when you woke up, you'd remember everything", then post hoc how is that any different from regular existence? For example, right now, I can say, "Last night I had beer with my friend Keith", and the beer-having exists in my memory, not as a current sensory experience. But if I'd taken the Ordinary Banana pill right before I went to the pub, then right now the beer-having would exist in my memory, in exactly the way it does when I didn't take the pill.
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Re: Twitter!

Post by nicole » 27 Nov 2019, 10:18

JD wrote:
27 Nov 2019, 10:10
Jasper wrote:
27 Nov 2019, 08:43
It sounds like the OP poll was essentially 'Would you like to be on general anesthesia for 8 hours at a time, but when you woke up, you'd remember everything?"

Which admittedly, as a dabbler in commerce, sounds intriguing.

Combine it with molly and speed and live out a self-imposed Huxley fever dream.
But if it's "when you woke up, you'd remember everything", then post hoc how is that any different from regular existence? For example, right now, I can say, "Last night I had beer with my friend Keith", and the beer-having exists in my memory, not as a current sensory experience. But if I'd taken the Ordinary Banana pill right before I went to the pub, then right now the beer-having would exist in my memory, in exactly the way it does when I didn't take the pill.
It's not different post hoc; it's different during.
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Re: Twitter!

Post by JD » 27 Nov 2019, 10:38

nicole wrote:
27 Nov 2019, 10:18
It's not different post hoc; it's different during.
But the question is how is it different, exactly. This is where my "not getting it" part comes in. If the answer is "but you wouldn't have qualia during the experience", then my response would be that in any observable, testable sense, you do/did have qualia. The only thing we're saying doesn't exist during the experience is, essentially, "that thing that you didn't have during the experience but you did before and do afterwards, including having a memory of having had it during the experience", which I would submit is a) circular, and b) not testable and hence not scientific.

In case it is not clear, Daniel Dennett is my jam, yo.

Perhaps a more fruitful question is, what is it about the pill that would make you want to take it?
I sort of feel like a sucker about aspiring to be intellectually rigorous when I could just go on twitter and say capitalism causes space herpes and no one will challenge me on it. - Hugh Akston

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Re: Twitter!

Post by nicole » 27 Nov 2019, 10:50

JD wrote:
27 Nov 2019, 10:38
nicole wrote:
27 Nov 2019, 10:18
It's not different post hoc; it's different during.
But the question is how is it different, exactly. This is where my "not getting it" part comes in. If the answer is "but you wouldn't have qualia during the experience", then my response would be that in any observable, testable sense, you do/did have qualia. The only thing we're saying doesn't exist during the experience is, essentially, "that thing that you didn't have during the experience but you did before and do afterwards, including having a memory of having had it during the experience", which I would submit is a) circular, and b) not testable and hence not scientific.

In case it is not clear, Daniel Dennett is my jam, yo.
Right, I mean, isn't this just like...the point of the p-zombie thought experiment? And obviously lots of people don't think a p-zombie is possible.

As far as what you're saying here--there definitely seems to me to be a difference between memories and experiences as they happen, for example, in real life you can have a false memory of something that you didn't experience, even though you think you remember yourself experiencing it. That is not the same as actually having experienced the thing.
JD wrote:
27 Nov 2019, 10:38
Perhaps a more fruitful question is, what is it about the pill that would make you want to take it?
I mean, it's basically what I'm like, always saying: that being awake/alive is bad, that consciousness is a horrible side effect of evolution that we all suffer from, etc.
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Re: Twitter!

Post by Jasper » 27 Nov 2019, 11:07

nicole wrote:
27 Nov 2019, 10:50
Right, I mean, isn't this just like...the point of the p-zombie thought experiment? And obviously lots of people don't think a p-zombie is possible.

As far as what you're saying here--there definitely seems to me to be a difference between memories and experiences as they happen, for example, in real life you can have a false memory of something that you didn't experience, even though you think you remember yourself experiencing it. That is not the same as actually having experienced the thing.
I'm pretty much with JD. I'm just trying to parse the distinction out as well.

If you also remember how tedious and boring the work shift or party was you experienced while under the influence, I'm not sure it's a plus.
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Re: Twitter!

Post by JD » 27 Nov 2019, 11:45

nicole wrote:
27 Nov 2019, 10:50
As far as what you're saying here--there definitely seems to me to be a difference between memories and experiences as they happen, for example, in real life you can have a false memory of something that you didn't experience, even though you think you remember yourself experiencing it. That is not the same as actually having experienced the thing.
I think there's definitely a difference between memories and experiences: if I remember my grandmother's face, no photons that bounced off her face are currently impacting my retinas, causing signals to flow through my optic nerve and into my visual cortex etc. But once the experience is in your memory, it's all the same from your perspective. Sure, you can have false memories (or false non-memories), but from your perspective I don't think there's any internal way to distinguish between "I have a memory of X and it happened" and "I have a memory of X and it didn't happen". If there were, wouldn't false memory basically not be an existing thing, because there would be a way to tell if the memory were false or not?

nicole wrote:
JD wrote:
27 Nov 2019, 10:38
Perhaps a more fruitful question is, what is it about the pill that would make you want to take it?
I mean, it's basically what I'm like, always saying: that being awake/alive is bad, that consciousness is a horrible side effect of evolution that we all suffer from, etc.
Hm. Does this make consciousness worse than death, or is death more bad, or just a different kind of bad?
I sort of feel like a sucker about aspiring to be intellectually rigorous when I could just go on twitter and say capitalism causes space herpes and no one will challenge me on it. - Hugh Akston

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Re: Twitter!

Post by Warren » 27 Nov 2019, 11:48

nicole,
Do you experience joy? Is consciousness a burden to you at such times?
I'm trying to wrap my mind around something like "I can't wait to finish having sex so I can remember it fondly and be done with suffering through it".
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Re: Twitter!

Post by nicole » 27 Nov 2019, 12:07

JD wrote:
27 Nov 2019, 11:45
nicole wrote:
27 Nov 2019, 10:50
As far as what you're saying here--there definitely seems to me to be a difference between memories and experiences as they happen, for example, in real life you can have a false memory of something that you didn't experience, even though you think you remember yourself experiencing it. That is not the same as actually having experienced the thing.
I think there's definitely a difference between memories and experiences: if I remember my grandmother's face, no photons that bounced off her face are currently impacting my retinas, causing signals to flow through my optic nerve and into my visual cortex etc. But once the experience is in your memory, it's all the same from your perspective. Sure, you can have false memories (or false non-memories), but from your perspective I don't think there's any internal way to distinguish between "I have a memory of X and it happened" and "I have a memory of X and it didn't happen". If there were, wouldn't false memory basically not be an existing thing, because there would be a way to tell if the memory were false or not?
I don't understand not seeing a difference between "I remember going through this thing that sucked" and "Here I am currently still going through this thing that sucks."
JD wrote:
27 Nov 2019, 11:45
nicole wrote:
JD wrote:
27 Nov 2019, 10:38
Perhaps a more fruitful question is, what is it about the pill that would make you want to take it?
I mean, it's basically what I'm like, always saying: that being awake/alive is bad, that consciousness is a horrible side effect of evolution that we all suffer from, etc.
Hm. Does this make consciousness worse than death, or is death more bad, or just a different kind of bad?
Yes, I definitely think consciousness is worse than death, because I don't think death is anything and I think consciousness is mostly bad.

ETA assuming that by "death" you mean "the state of being dead" and not "the process of dying" which could certainly be painful
Last edited by nicole on 27 Nov 2019, 12:10, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Twitter!

Post by nicole » 27 Nov 2019, 12:10

Warren wrote:
27 Nov 2019, 11:48
nicole,
Do you experience joy? Is consciousness a burden to you at such times?
I'm trying to wrap my mind around something like "I can't wait to finish having sex so I can remember it fondly and be done with suffering through it".
I'm not anhedonic and I don't necessarily want to avoid positive experiences, but I would like to not be awake for any of the other ones.

Is it easier to wrap your mind around, "Wouldn't it be great if I didn't have to be conscious during the workday but could still do my job and get paid for it?"
"Fucking qualia." -Hugh Akston

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Re: Twitter!

Post by JasonL » 27 Nov 2019, 12:13

I'm way behind in this thread, but I'll just say that my overall sense with p-zombie type arguments is that they operate by claiming a massively contingent property can be excised while holding all else constant. I don't really think that's a valid mode of reasoning. I'm trying to think of a good analogy but not doing great. I'm highly skeptical of isolating either the consciousness from the meat or the meat from the consciousness. I'm a singularity skeptic for this reason.

One way to think about this is lets say it's not one pill that nullifies consciousness in toto all at once, but a series of switches that can be engaged in sequence that remove elements of consciousness. Say the first one deactivates awareness of pain only. You put your hand on the stove and it registers as data and you remove your hand but you have no sense of an "I" that "hurts". How many switches can you flip and still have a sense that "all else behavior wise is the same". I don't think it works that way.

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Re: Twitter!

Post by Warren » 27 Nov 2019, 12:17

nicole wrote:
27 Nov 2019, 12:10
Warren wrote:
27 Nov 2019, 11:48
nicole,
Do you experience joy? Is consciousness a burden to you at such times?
I'm trying to wrap my mind around something like "I can't wait to finish having sex so I can remember it fondly and be done with suffering through it".
I'm not anhedonic and I don't necessarily want to avoid positive experiences, but I would like to not be awake for any of the other ones.

Is it easier to wrap your mind around, "Wouldn't it be great if I didn't have to be conscious during the workday but could still do my job and get paid for it?"
Oh well yeah. I think we're all on board with that. But you have oft said you find existence itself abhorrent, which seems to me to go beyond that.
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Re: Twitter!

Post by JD » 27 Nov 2019, 12:36

nicole wrote:
27 Nov 2019, 12:07
JD wrote:
27 Nov 2019, 11:45
I think there's definitely a difference between memories and experiences: if I remember my grandmother's face, no photons that bounced off her face are currently impacting my retinas, causing signals to flow through my optic nerve and into my visual cortex etc. But once the experience is in your memory, it's all the same from your perspective. Sure, you can have false memories (or false non-memories), but from your perspective I don't think there's any internal way to distinguish between "I have a memory of X and it happened" and "I have a memory of X and it didn't happen". If there were, wouldn't false memory basically not be an existing thing, because there would be a way to tell if the memory were false or not?
I don't understand not seeing a difference between "I remember going through this thing that sucked" and "Here I am currently still going through this thing that sucks."
Not sure I understand you, because I said "I think there's definitely a difference between memories and experiences".
I sort of feel like a sucker about aspiring to be intellectually rigorous when I could just go on twitter and say capitalism causes space herpes and no one will challenge me on it. - Hugh Akston

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Re: Twitter!

Post by nicole » 27 Nov 2019, 13:10

JasonL wrote:
27 Nov 2019, 12:13
I'm way behind in this thread, but I'll just say that my overall sense with p-zombie type arguments is that they operate by claiming a massively contingent property can be excised while holding all else constant. I don't really think that's a valid mode of reasoning. I'm trying to think of a good analogy but not doing great. I'm highly skeptical of isolating either the consciousness from the meat or the meat from the consciousness. I'm a singularity skeptic for this reason.

One way to think about this is lets say it's not one pill that nullifies consciousness in toto all at once, but a series of switches that can be engaged in sequence that remove elements of consciousness. Say the first one deactivates awareness of pain only. You put your hand on the stove and it registers as data and you remove your hand but you have no sense of an "I" that "hurts". How many switches can you flip and still have a sense that "all else behavior wise is the same". I don't think it works that way.
I mean, I also don't think p-zombies are real.
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Re: Twitter!

Post by JD » 27 Nov 2019, 13:38

JasonL wrote:
27 Nov 2019, 12:13
One way to think about this is lets say it's not one pill that nullifies consciousness in toto all at once, but a series of switches that can be engaged in sequence that remove elements of consciousness. Say the first one deactivates awareness of pain only. You put your hand on the stove and it registers as data and you remove your hand but you have no sense of an "I" that "hurts". How many switches can you flip and still have a sense that "all else behavior wise is the same". I don't think it works that way.
Interestingly enough, there are people who don't feel pain, but (I'm pretty sure) who, if they put their hand on a hot stove, are still aware of feeling their hand on the stove. Some of them apparently feel "pain" but are indifferent to it, which just gets deeper into the philosophical debate. But I'm pretty sure they still have a sense of self that something is happening to.

Maybe the closest thing we have to a real-world case of case of the magic pill are depersonalization-derealization disorder and Cotard Delusion (in which a person believes that he is dead).
I sort of feel like a sucker about aspiring to be intellectually rigorous when I could just go on twitter and say capitalism causes space herpes and no one will challenge me on it. - Hugh Akston

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Re: Twitter!

Post by D.A. Ridgely » 27 Nov 2019, 13:47

Nicole's lament reminds me of an old Peanuts cartoon where Linus is patiently explaining to Lucy that everyone's life has its ups and downs or hills and valleys and Lucy screams she only wants the Hills, NO VALLEYS! or some such.

Anyway, it strikes me that the solution for the pain of being at / doing work is finding somewhere else to do something else that pays as well, not skipping somewhere upwards of a quarter of one's conscious existence internally comatose, even if memories were being stored during the time for later retrieval. But, hey, that's just me. That said, were one able to sleep-walk through work or any other likely unpleasant experiences only to be able to recall that period of time as well as if one were awake and aware, there would still be a qualitative difference in that one's memories of, e.g., pain are not the experience of pain, itself. Even the precise memory of, say, an argument one had which frustrated and angered one at the time is not the same experience as the actual frustration and anger in situ. Whether that's a preferable way to spend one's life I'll leave to those who are contemplating their advantages and disadvantages.

Most of the talk of p-zombies is, well, let's say metaphorical. The philosophical idea of p-zombies is an argument for or against strict physicalism depending on where one stands on that issue and, as always, there's a reliable if lengthy discussion of the topic at the Stanford Encyclopedia of Philosophy. Basically, is it even conceivable, and if conceivable is it even possible (the two being logically distinct questions, or so many believe) that p-zombies could live among us; that is, beings who (that?) behaved exactly as human beings do including, critically, discussing their apparent conscious states though without actually having any conscious experience. In that sense, irrespective of whatever state of disassociation nicole may aspire to, one cannot say the experience of being a p-zombie is like anything or is anything at all because it is literally, by definition, the absence of experience.

There are curiosities that arise from the idea. For example, we take it as a given that we are all epistemologically privileged regarding our own conscious experiences, a fact that gives rise to its own philosophically interesting curiosities, e.g., it makes no sense to say "I think I'm feeling pain but I might be mistaken." Ordinarily, we credit reports of others' conscious experiences as truthful and accurate unless we have actual (that is, non-philosophical) reasons to doubt such reports. When a p-zombie says "I feel pain" or "I see a red apple" or whatever, even if we have none of the usual reasons to doubt such reports, it would still make sense, if but only if we knew they were p-zombies, to conclude such reports were either false or meaningless. False, certainly, in that by definition they did not feel pain or see colors as we do and as we understand others do when they make the same reports; but also arguably meaningless depending upon what theory of truth one thinks is appropriate for what is putatively an empirical claim.

In any case, a p-zombie having not-experienced a hard day at work would similarly not be able later to enjoy not being at work nor able to remember the disagreeable experience of being at work because there would not have been any disagreeable experience nor would the act of later retrieving whatever constituted its stored data from that time be, itself, an experience. By definition, there would be no valleys nor any hills nor any conscious experience after the fact of either because there would be no consciousness at all. It would all be a flat line, if that.

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Jadagul
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Re: Twitter!

Post by Jadagul » 27 Nov 2019, 14:54

Warren wrote:
27 Nov 2019, 12:17
nicole wrote:
27 Nov 2019, 12:10
Warren wrote:
27 Nov 2019, 11:48
nicole,
Do you experience joy? Is consciousness a burden to you at such times?
I'm trying to wrap my mind around something like "I can't wait to finish having sex so I can remember it fondly and be done with suffering through it".
I'm not anhedonic and I don't necessarily want to avoid positive experiences, but I would like to not be awake for any of the other ones.

Is it easier to wrap your mind around, "Wouldn't it be great if I didn't have to be conscious during the workday but could still do my job and get paid for it?"
Oh well yeah. I think we're all on board with that. But you have oft said you find existence itself abhorrent, which seems to me to go beyond that.
Why would you be on board with that? That's insane.

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D.A. Ridgely
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Re: Twitter!

Post by D.A. Ridgely » 27 Nov 2019, 15:03

Jadagul wrote:
27 Nov 2019, 14:54
Warren wrote:
27 Nov 2019, 12:17
nicole wrote:
27 Nov 2019, 12:10
Warren wrote:
27 Nov 2019, 11:48
nicole,
Do you experience joy? Is consciousness a burden to you at such times?
I'm trying to wrap my mind around something like "I can't wait to finish having sex so I can remember it fondly and be done with suffering through it".
I'm not anhedonic and I don't necessarily want to avoid positive experiences, but I would like to not be awake for any of the other ones.

Is it easier to wrap your mind around, "Wouldn't it be great if I didn't have to be conscious during the workday but could still do my job and get paid for it?"
Oh well yeah. I think we're all on board with that. But you have oft said you find existence itself abhorrent, which seems to me to go beyond that.
Why would you be on board with that? That's insane.
Insane largely because you're one of the small number of people who, even counting the non-academic nonsense that goes along with it, enjoys what you do for a living. I'd guess that less than 10% of the workforce can actually honestly say that.

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Jadagul
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Re: Twitter!

Post by Jadagul » 27 Nov 2019, 15:19

D.A. Ridgely wrote:
27 Nov 2019, 15:03
Jadagul wrote:
27 Nov 2019, 14:54
Warren wrote:
27 Nov 2019, 12:17
nicole wrote:
27 Nov 2019, 12:10
Warren wrote:
27 Nov 2019, 11:48
nicole,
Do you experience joy? Is consciousness a burden to you at such times?
I'm trying to wrap my mind around something like "I can't wait to finish having sex so I can remember it fondly and be done with suffering through it".
I'm not anhedonic and I don't necessarily want to avoid positive experiences, but I would like to not be awake for any of the other ones.

Is it easier to wrap your mind around, "Wouldn't it be great if I didn't have to be conscious during the workday but could still do my job and get paid for it?"
Oh well yeah. I think we're all on board with that. But you have oft said you find existence itself abhorrent, which seems to me to go beyond that.
Why would you be on board with that? That's insane.
Insane largely because you're one of the small number of people who, even counting the non-academic nonsense that goes along with it, enjoys what you do for a living. I'd guess that less than 10% of the workforce can actually honestly say that.
I mean, yeah, I enjoy my job. But I thought the surprising part was how much I enjoy my job relative to non-job things I do.

Obviously I'd prefer experiencing life to not-experiencing it. Life is great! Existing is great. I wouldn't want to lose like a third of my life.

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