Mr. Robot: with spoilers

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Kolohe
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Re: Mr. Robot: with spoilers

Post by Kolohe » 12 Oct 2017, 17:35

The eviction notice was a nod to whatsherface, (Kayla?) who is dead an nobody even realizes she is gone except she hasn't paid rent in 3 months.
when you wake up as the queen of the n=1 kingdom and mount your steed non sequiturius, do you look out upon all you survey and think “damn, it feels good to be a green idea sleeping furiously?" - dhex

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Re: Mr. Robot: with spoilers

Post by Kolohe » 12 Oct 2017, 17:42

But i agree with you about the economy. And if power were out for a solid week, the streets would be empty at night, and *no one* would be out on the streets conducting any sort of non-vice related commerce after dark.

(Heck with fuel shortages and power grid off line, they certainly wouldn't be running city buses at night - or alternatively running them mostly empty. It would be similar to third world bus service, with erratic scheduling, and everyone pilling in to overflowing when any vehicle did stop by)
when you wake up as the queen of the n=1 kingdom and mount your steed non sequiturius, do you look out upon all you survey and think “damn, it feels good to be a green idea sleeping furiously?" - dhex

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Jennifer
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Re: Mr. Robot: with spoilers

Post by Jennifer » 12 Oct 2017, 17:52

Kolohe wrote:
12 Oct 2017, 17:35
The eviction notice was a nod to whatsherface, (Kayla?) who is dead an nobody even realizes she is gone except she hasn't paid rent in 3 months.
Ah, I forgot about Shayla. The show never mentions what Elliot did with her dead body, but IIRC the FBI knows she's dead, since she was on that big whiteboard Dom showed Darlene in last season's finale. But, yeah, I dunno if Shayla's landlord would've been informed of this.
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Re: Mr. Robot: with spoilers

Post by Jennifer » 12 Oct 2017, 17:59

And another thing (yes, I'm ranting here) -- that scene in the Red Wheelbarrow barbecue shop, where the guy wants a milkshake and is told it costs $12.50 -- again, people are limited to 50 bucks per day. Who's going to pay one-quarter of their daily income on a single milkshake? I dunno if that price is meant to indicate "Heh, Manhattan sure is expensive, ain't it?" or possibly an indicator of high inflation post-5/9 ... but if anything, if people are limited to $50 per day you'd expect to see massive deflation, at least for non-essentials. Even in the ritzy parts of Manhattan, I don't expect you'd see $12.50 milkshake shops staying in business.
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Re: Mr. Robot: with spoilers

Post by Jennifer » 19 Oct 2017, 15:35

Last night's episode was definitely better than last week's, and good riddance to Joanna. I wonder what's going to happen to Scott Knowles, now that the one witness who claimed he killed his wife got killed while murdering Tyrell's? I'm guessing Scott can still afford a good lawyer -- but that lawyer still wouldn't know what we-the-viewers do about the connection between Joanna and the bartender.
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Re: Mr. Robot: with spoilers

Post by Kolohe » 23 Oct 2017, 08:25

The problem with Joanna's death for me is that it's a canary in the coal mine that may mean Sam Esmail is doing the "Cylon's have a plan" gambit.

While being coy about it, the show strongly suggested she was a string puller on par with Price and White Rose - but now she goes out like a chump.

To address something from earlier, yes, the economics are rubbish, between the whole e-coin/bit-coin international thing, apples (the eating kind) 5 bucks apiece - but kids riding around of electric hoverboards. Plus E-corp able to operate with 2 or 3 layers of useless middle management, while the government is able to be somewhat ruthlessly efficient in arresting white collar criminals. A government that still works, despite Weimar Germany levels of inflation.

But the milkshake thing sorta makes sense in that - isn't Red Whellbarrow a front, and thus doesn't need to make economic sense as a enterprise? Plus, Irving (the character) is a guy who's operating 'above' society. Like how Price was able to throw money around at that restaurant to impress Angela immediately after 5/9, Irving could be spending 12.50 for a milkshake just because he can. It's a status/power move.
when you wake up as the queen of the n=1 kingdom and mount your steed non sequiturius, do you look out upon all you survey and think “damn, it feels good to be a green idea sleeping furiously?" - dhex

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Re: Mr. Robot: with spoilers

Post by Jennifer » 23 Oct 2017, 14:05

Kolohe wrote:
23 Oct 2017, 08:25
The problem with Joanna's death for me is that it's a canary in the coal mine that may mean Sam Esmail is doing the "Cylon's have a plan" gambit.

While being coy about it, the show strongly suggested she was a string puller on par with Price and White Rose - but now she goes out like a chump.
If she'd died in a car accident or some similarly random thing I'd agree (though even in real life, important power-players can die unexpectedly -- if Oliver Cromwell's career were a piece of political fiction, I'd say killing him off with a kidney stone was a cop-out from the author, but the real-life story of English history really DOES end his chapter that way). However, her death was not unexpected, in hindsight -- Derek clearly was the type of man who'd be willing to tell a bald-faced lie to the police regarding an internationally known murder. (Not that I'm saying "Anybody who'd lie to a cop is clearly one step away from being a murderer himself" -- but lying about a murder is very different from "Oh no, Officer, I don't smoke weed and don't even know where to get it" or even "I saw and heard nothing during that commotion last night.") Then, almost immediately after he told his lie, Joanna went on national TV to re-affirm her love for Tyrell and also tell the bald-faced lie that she's always loved him and always been faithful to him--no difficulty imagining how Derek felt about that.

I am wondering very much what this means for Scott Knowles' legal future, though. Any lawyers here care to speculate? Assuming Joanna's bodyguard keeps his mouth shut-- nobody living knows Derek was lying to the police, nor that Derek and Joanna had an affair. All anybody knows is: someone murdered Sharon Knowles at that ECorp party, and since Tyrell Wellick disappeared soon afterward, everyone assumed he'd done it. Then, some months later, Joanna gets beaten up by Scott, and says that during the beating, Scott confessed to murdering his wife. Then the bartender from that long-ago party steps forward and says HE saw Scott there that night. Police take this claim seriously, especially since they think there's no connection between the bartender and any other major players--until the bartender murders Joanna and is himself killed by the bodyguard. The only two "witnesses" willing to tie Scott to the murder are dead, and died in a bizarre way which strongly suggests they had some sort of connection.
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Re: Mr. Robot: with spoilers

Post by Shem » 24 Oct 2017, 16:25

Kolohe wrote:
23 Oct 2017, 08:25
apples (the eating kind) 5 bucks apiece - but kids riding around of electric hoverboards.
In that situation, the guy selling consumer luxuries is desperate in a way the guy selling food isn't.
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Re: Mr. Robot: with spoilers

Post by Jennifer » 26 Oct 2017, 14:59

Jennifer wrote:
28 Nov 2016, 19:31
Kolohe wrote:my gut feel is that they're going to diverge significantly from the real-world timeline. Trump is not 'the system' the way Clinton is.

eta: i mean, the show's creator is not going to be able to come to terms with the fact that Trump effed society better than fsociety could have ever dreamed of.
True. On the other hand, I don't think it would be too difficult to work Trump into the "hackers fuck things up" storyline. There's still a lot of nefarious-conspiracy stuff we don't know -- what exactly are Tyrell and Stephanie plotting, what is White Rose up to, etc. -- and also plenty o real-world hacker stories related to the campaign and election.

Though Esmail supposedly has the entire Mr Robot storyline written out -- IIRC he originally wrote it as a single-movie screenplay, so the series is presumably a vastly expanded, detailed version of that story. If Esmail's originally planned ending is "Hackers trying to make the world better are actually helping a bigger, more nefarious conspiracy, and seriously fuck everything up," President Trump might actually work out better for the story than any normal president ever could.
Yup, looks like Esmail is indeed working Trump's presidency into his nefarious hacker conspiracy.

Kinda sucks when dystopian fiction is more cheerful than reality -- for all that I'd be outraged to discover "The reason we have that narcissistic twatwaffle in the White House is because of an evil conspiracy by foreign power-brokers," it's preferable to "Because a whole bunch of my fellow Amercan voters are racist fucksticks."
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Re: Mr. Robot: with spoilers

Post by Kolohe » 30 Oct 2017, 10:44

So the FBI agent is a mole, which we all kinda figured, but Nerdy Alex Jones is *also* a mole, which was a geniuine surprise. And a twist I wonder was really in the works the whole time. Obviously, that scene wasn't.

That scene was far less clever than it thought it was. It's also kinda dumb for a supervillian to rely on Donald Trump for furthering the supervillian plans.

(I'm curious how good BD Wong's mandarin accent is, as the actor was born in California)
when you wake up as the queen of the n=1 kingdom and mount your steed non sequiturius, do you look out upon all you survey and think “damn, it feels good to be a green idea sleeping furiously?" - dhex

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Re: Mr. Robot: with spoilers

Post by Jennifer » 30 Oct 2017, 16:33

Kolohe wrote:
30 Oct 2017, 10:44
So the FBI agent is a mole, which we all kinda figured, but Nerdy Alex Jones is *also* a mole, which was a geniuine surprise. And a twist I wonder was really in the works the whole time. Obviously, that scene wasn't.

That scene was far less clever than it thought it was. It's also kinda dumb for a supervillian to rely on Donald Trump for furthering the supervillian plans.
But is it that Trump will deliberately help the supervillain agenda, or more of an "anything which fucks up or destabilizes America's economic or political system will help?" An American government that is generally competent, well-funded and has its shit together is presumably far more likely to investigate a toxic energy plant than a broke and dysfunctional government headed by a pathological narcissist.

I too was surprised by Frank Cody but not by Dom's boss. Though as I think about it, having Frank Cody on the dark army side does work in retrospect, up to his softball interview with Joanna.
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Re: Mr. Robot: with spoilers

Post by Shem » 31 Oct 2017, 19:41

Kolohe wrote:
30 Oct 2017, 10:44
(I'm curious how good BD Wong's mandarin accent is, as the actor was born in California)
I'm curious too, but more because his family is from Hong Kong.
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Re: Mr. Robot: with spoilers

Post by Jennifer » 02 Nov 2017, 12:34

Among those who follow behind-the-scenes gossip, apparently there's been a rumor that one episode this season is going to be a one-shot episode, and since the preview last night said next week's episode will be commercial-free, the Robot fans on reddit think next week's is going to be it.
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Re: Mr. Robot: with spoilers

Post by Kolohe » 08 Nov 2017, 08:41

Poor Flipper can't catch a break.

Gummer's characterization continues to vex me. Unless the twist is that she also has multiple personalities.

it's amazing and a bit unbelievable how they're able to keep the info from Tyrell on what happened to Joanna. (But wait, the general public doesn't know she's dead either, right?)

I'm recording the next 'commericial free' episode in the overnight airing (can't in the first due to other DVR commitments) - it's six minutes longer, but 6 minutes is usually less time than the alloted commericial time in an hour long episode. I wonder if I'm going to miss something.
when you wake up as the queen of the n=1 kingdom and mount your steed non sequiturius, do you look out upon all you survey and think “damn, it feels good to be a green idea sleeping furiously?" - dhex

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Re: Mr. Robot: with spoilers

Post by Kolohe » 08 Nov 2017, 23:03

I saw tonight's episode live, and it was epic.
when you wake up as the queen of the n=1 kingdom and mount your steed non sequiturius, do you look out upon all you survey and think “damn, it feels good to be a green idea sleeping furiously?" - dhex

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Re: Mr. Robot: with spoilers

Post by Jennifer » 09 Nov 2017, 13:01

That was a VERY good episode indeed. And the single-shot appearance actually did make it better, by showing this stuff is all happening in real time.

There was one Easter egg I did not catch myself, but saw on the reddit post-episode discussion thread: when Angela was wearing the FSociety mask and going back to the elevator, with various other FSociety people making mayhem in the background, there was one blurry glimpse of a man who looked an awful lot like Elliot, at least regarding the haircut, hoodie and backpack.
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Re: Mr. Robot: with spoilers

Post by Kolohe » 16 Nov 2017, 12:52

This show is on fire. I just wish they wouldn't shit over their own work with Donald Trump references. They're obnoxious and obvious, but perhaps that's the point.
when you wake up as the queen of the n=1 kingdom and mount your steed non sequiturius, do you look out upon all you survey and think “damn, it feels good to be a green idea sleeping furiously?" - dhex

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Re: Mr. Robot: with spoilers

Post by Jennifer » 16 Nov 2017, 12:59

I think the Trump thing actually kinda works, though. Given Esmail's apparent intended storyline, plus how the for-reals election played out, I don't see how they can't mention him. And at least it's more of a nudge-nudge-wink-wink thing; they're not specifically naming Donald Trump. This isn't the first time the Mr Robot storyline -- which is still somewhere in autumn 2015 --made use of news which real-world viewers wouldn't learn until later; last season was a reference suggesting ECorp is responsible for the bad water in Flint, Michigan.

That ending DID catch me by surprise, though after perusing the Robot subreddit last night, apparently there WAS one person who predicted it two or three weeks ago; there were little clues and Easter eggs hidden in earlier episodes.
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Re: Mr. Robot: with spoilers

Post by Jennifer » 16 Nov 2017, 13:09

Also, referring to the scenes from next week: I AM looking forward to Joey Badass coming back, and hope Trenton and Mobley do as well.
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Re: Mr. Robot: with spoilers

Post by Kolohe » 16 Nov 2017, 13:13

My objection is that is clearly a retcon when they bring it front and center (and if they make it part of the main plot, I can't even). it's very much like Lucas putting CGI clutter in his special editions.

It was fine when they made it a silly throwaway line last season. But last season, they also made the US Treasury Secretary and Chair of the Fed (and one other high US official I can't remember) completely ineffectual empty suits. Making Trump 'important' is contrary to one of the main themes they've been pushing for the entire show's run.

There was an appearance from Joey Bada$$ earlier this season, that I think I missed by recording that episode when it re-aired later in the week.
when you wake up as the queen of the n=1 kingdom and mount your steed non sequiturius, do you look out upon all you survey and think “damn, it feels good to be a green idea sleeping furiously?" - dhex

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Re: Mr. Robot: with spoilers

Post by Jennifer » 16 Nov 2017, 13:26

Kolohe wrote:
16 Nov 2017, 13:13
My objection is that is clearly a retcon when they bring it front and center (and if they make it part of the main plot, I can't even). it's very much like Lucas putting CGI clutter in his special editions.

It was fine when they made it a silly throwaway line last season. But last season, they also made the US Treasury Secretary and Chair of the Fed (and one other high US official I can't remember) completely ineffectual empty suits. Making Trump 'important' is contrary to one of the main themes they've been pushing for the entire show's run.
See, I don't know if "important" is precisely the right word here. I mean, obviously Trump is "important" in the sense that any POTUS is, but every in-show mention of him is of a buffoon getting no respect from the guys pulling strings behind the scenes. Which makes perfect sense, if White Rose's plan regarding the US is some version of "Trash the country to hell, so China can fill the power vacuum left behind." Arguably, something not too different is playing out in our timeline now, without even requiring a hacker-army conspiracy. (I have not yet read the most recent issue of the Economist -- it's sitting on my kitchen table as I type this -- but the cover illustration is of a cartoon American eagle with a Trump toupee on its head, under the headline "ENDANGERED: America's future as a global power.")
There was an appearance from Joey Bada$$ earlier this season, that I think I missed by recording that episode when it re-aired later in the week.
Oh, yeah, I forgot about that. But his earlier appearance was merely in flashback form, going back to when Elliot was either still in prison or had just been released. Assuming next week is not a flashback, it'll be his first appearance actually moving the plot forward, as opposed to going back and filling in blanks about things we didn't know.
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Re: Mr. Robot: with spoilers

Post by Kolohe » 16 Nov 2017, 15:55

Trump is the guy who acts like a stereotype of the rich guy, right? But is not as rich as he presents himself as, plus surrounds himself with people that are more pretend rich than rich rich.

Why would actual Masters of the Universe give that clown the time of day? White Rose has a super duper private island; I'm sure Price also has super duper elite crib. They have things like the Eyes Wide Shut Illuminati Club from the coda of season 1.

Why are they meeting in a dump like Mar a Lago? Donald Trump is so beneath them, he's not even worth their time in mocking him.
when you wake up as the queen of the n=1 kingdom and mount your steed non sequiturius, do you look out upon all you survey and think “damn, it feels good to be a green idea sleeping furiously?" - dhex

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Re: Mr. Robot: with spoilers

Post by Jennifer » 16 Nov 2017, 16:08

Kolohe wrote:
16 Nov 2017, 15:55
Trump is the guy who acts like a stereotype of the rich guy, right? But is not as rich as he presents himself as, plus surrounds himself with people that are more pretend rich than rich rich.

Why would actual Masters of the Universe give that clown the time of day? White Rose has a super duper private island; I'm sure Price also has super duper elite crib. They have things like the Eyes Wide Shut Illuminati Club from the coda of season 1.
But by now -- as in the real-world counterpart to this point in the story's timeline -- it's looking as though Trump might really have a chance of becoming the next POTUS in the November 2016 election (especially if you have additional secret-conspiracy knowledge ordinary political observers do not). And even if you belong to a sekrit cabal so powerful that the total combined US government and military strength is puny and weak by comparison, it's easy to think of many evil (or at least, against US interests but helpful to other countries) plans that would work much more easily if the US is turning into a shitshow. Wrecking the economy is a good first step toward turning a country into a shitshow, yes, but it's much better if you can get a complete lunatic buffoon like Trump in charge of the country, too. I don't know how much the plans of "White Rose" align with the interests of "the Chinese government and its security minister," but whether they're different or the same, they'd certainly benefit if the US is too weak or dysfunctional to project itself as a world power. Right now, in Mr Robot world, Obama is still POTUS yet China still got the Congo. Trump's administration will be far more dysfunctional than Obama's at its worst.
Why are they meeting in a dump like Mar a Lago? Donald Trump is so beneath them, he's not even worth their time in mocking him.
They addressed that-- at the very beginning of the scene Price says something like "Why did Sergei host a party in this tasteless dump?"
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Re: Mr. Robot: with spoilers

Post by Kolohe » 16 Nov 2017, 17:57

Jennifer wrote:
16 Nov 2017, 16:08
They addressed that-- at the very beginning of the scene Price says something like "Why did Sergei host a party in this tasteless dump?"
That's a good point.
when you wake up as the queen of the n=1 kingdom and mount your steed non sequiturius, do you look out upon all you survey and think “damn, it feels good to be a green idea sleeping furiously?" - dhex

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Re: Mr. Robot: with spoilers

Post by Jennifer » 23 Nov 2017, 01:52

Damn. This show got a lot darker, these past two episodes. Huge disappointment abut Trenton and Mobley.
"Myself, despite what they say about libertarians, I think we're actually allowed to pursue options beyond futility or sucking the dicks of the powerful." -- Eric the .5b

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