Orange is the new President

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Jennifer
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Re: Orange is the new President

Post by Jennifer » 29 Aug 2018, 15:26

Hugh Akston wrote:
29 Aug 2018, 14:21
The Trump Administration's pot policy is so weird. He never mentions pot in his rambling rally speeches or his Fox News call-ins. Who is he appealing to with this? Are law enforcement groups lobbying him? Is this Jeff Sessions' pet project? Did Kevin Sabet buy ad time during Fox & Friends?
He's catering to the full horror of public whim, presumably. Though who exactly comprises "the public" here has yet to be determined.
"Myself, despite what they say about libertarians, I think we're actually allowed to pursue options beyond futility or sucking the dicks of the powerful." -- Eric the .5b

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JD
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Re: Orange is the new President

Post by JD » 29 Aug 2018, 15:27

Somewhat relevantly, wretched troglodyte Robert Reich has propounded that if Trump is found guilty of...well, something, anyway, then he should not just be impeached and convicted, but his presidency "annulled", by which he means that the entire administration must go and every single act it carried out methodically invalidated.

While that has a certain amount of fantasy appeal, there are a few problems. First, he fantasizes that
Suppose, just suppose, Robert Mueller finds overwhelming and indisputable evidence that Trump conspired with Russian President Vladimir Putin to rig the 2016 election, and the rigging determined the election’s outcome.

In other words, Trump’s presidency is not authorized under the United States Constitution.
Sure, except that pretty much nobody has suggested there was "rigging" as it's normally understood. There were dirty tricks, there were propaganda campaigns, but I haven't heard anybody suggest that the election itself was "rigged": people still went to the polls and voted as they do in every election, and the votes were counted correctly and the Electoral College functioned as it usually does, as far as anybody has suggested.

There's no question that if there were a serious finding of a rigged election, it would trigger a crisis, because we don't have a good way of dealing with that. (I think that that's true almost by definition: a system of rules by its very nature doesn't deal with situations outside the rules.) But his fantasy solution - "The Constitution also gives Congress and the states the power to amend the Constitution, thereby annulling or altering whatever provisions came before. Here, too, it would logically follow that Congress and the states could, through amendment, annul a presidency they determine to be unconstitutional" - doesn't seem very well-thought-out either; could the states, say, pass an amendment saying "The North Korea Friendship Act of 2019 is hereby null and void"?
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Shem
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Re: Orange is the new President

Post by Shem » 29 Aug 2018, 15:37

Hugh Akston wrote:
29 Aug 2018, 14:21
The Trump Administration's pot policy is so weird. He never mentions pot in his rambling rally speeches or his Fox News call-ins. Who is he appealing to with this? Are law enforcement groups lobbying him? Is this Jeff Sessions' pet project? Did Kevin Sabet buy ad time during Fox & Friends?
Were I to guess, I'd say it's a combination of Sessions' obsession and kickbacks from liquor companies.
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nicole
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Re: Orange is the new President

Post by nicole » 29 Aug 2018, 15:43

Jennifer wrote:
29 Aug 2018, 15:26
Hugh Akston wrote:
29 Aug 2018, 14:21
The Trump Administration's pot policy is so weird. He never mentions pot in his rambling rally speeches or his Fox News call-ins. Who is he appealing to with this? Are law enforcement groups lobbying him? Is this Jeff Sessions' pet project? Did Kevin Sabet buy ad time during Fox & Friends?
He's catering to the full horror of public whim, presumably. Though who exactly comprises "the public" here has yet to be determined.
Probably the vast majority of people who want you to suffer to justify the fact that they haven't killed themselves even though their lives are shit.
"Fucking qualia." -Hugh Akston

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JasonL
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Re: Orange is the new President

Post by JasonL » 29 Aug 2018, 15:45

I'd go with the same appeals you hear elsewhere to the pro-cop community and rural populations having discomfort with rural drug abuse generally. IOW - yes it's an appeal to his base that are themselves hearing in churches and from Our Men in Blue that Something Needs to be Done.
Last edited by JasonL on 29 Aug 2018, 15:46, edited 1 time in total.

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Aresen
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Re: Orange is the new President

Post by Aresen » 29 Aug 2018, 15:45

nicole wrote:
29 Aug 2018, 13:11
The White House has secretly amassed a committee of federal agencies from across the government to combat public support for marijuana and cast state legalization measures in a negative light, while attempting to portray the drug as a national threat, according to interviews with agency staff and documents obtained by BuzzFeed News.

The Marijuana Policy Coordination Committee, as it’s named in White House memos and emails, instructed 14 federal agencies and the Drug Enforcement Administration this month to submit “data demonstrating the most significant negative trends” about marijuana and the “threats” it poses to the country.
https://www.buzzfeednews.com/article/do ... -marijuana
This is pure chatter. Every administration since Teddy Roosevelt has done its best to demonize pot. I doubt the Trump administration considers this a 'secret'. This is a left version of 'Black Helicopters.'
If Trump supporters wanted a tough guy, why did they elect such a whiny bitch? - Mo

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Jennifer
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Re: Orange is the new President

Post by Jennifer » 29 Aug 2018, 15:50

nicole wrote:
29 Aug 2018, 15:43
Jennifer wrote:
29 Aug 2018, 15:26
Hugh Akston wrote:
29 Aug 2018, 14:21
The Trump Administration's pot policy is so weird. He never mentions pot in his rambling rally speeches or his Fox News call-ins. Who is he appealing to with this? Are law enforcement groups lobbying him? Is this Jeff Sessions' pet project? Did Kevin Sabet buy ad time during Fox & Friends?
He's catering to the full horror of public whim, presumably. Though who exactly comprises "the public" here has yet to be determined.
Probably the vast majority of people who want you to suffer to justify the fact that they haven't killed themselves even though their lives are shit.
No doubt Trump is appealing to the more psychopathic (in the sense of "completely lacking empathy") segments of his base -- including Jeff "I used to like the Klan until I learned some of 'em smoked pot, heh heh heh" Sessions. But I do find it amusing in the specific context of this section of the thread: "Blame 'public whim' for the behaviors of a man who lost the popular vote. Blame 'public whim' even when he tries pushing ideas the majority of the public clearly opposes. Blame 'public whim' because it's easier than considering maybe, just maybe, 'the public' doesn't have as much say over the government as our schooldays civics textbooks might have led us to believe."
"Myself, despite what they say about libertarians, I think we're actually allowed to pursue options beyond futility or sucking the dicks of the powerful." -- Eric the .5b

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Aresen
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Re: Orange is the new President

Post by Aresen » 29 Aug 2018, 16:03

I wonder what people over in Earth45HRC ('the Hillaverse') are complaining about. Has Title IX been extended to pre-schools yet? Has the EPA ordered the auto industry to stop producing cars with internal combustion engines by 2025? Are people protesting the new regime in Syria?
If Trump supporters wanted a tough guy, why did they elect such a whiny bitch? - Mo

Those who know history are doomed to deja vu. - the innominate one

Never bring a knife to a joke fight" - dhex

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JasonL
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Re: Orange is the new President

Post by JasonL » 29 Aug 2018, 16:04

If you don't think there are substantial segments of the demos who oppose drug liberalization you are not very observant.

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Eric the .5b
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Re: Orange is the new President

Post by Eric the .5b » 29 Aug 2018, 16:09

JasonL wrote:
29 Aug 2018, 16:04
If you don't think there are substantial segments of the demos who oppose drug liberalization you are not very observant.
Ayup. Getting past 50% support just means nearly 50% oppose it.

It's a losing fight, but until it's moot, opposition to marijuana liberalization will be a Team Red brand distinction. Hell, probably for a generation after; opposition to gay marriage is still very much a thing, there.
"Better that ten guilty persons escape than that one innocent suffer."
"Cyberpunk never really gave the government enough credit for their ability to secure a favorable prenup during the Corporate-State wedding." - Shem

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Aresen
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Re: Orange is the new President

Post by Aresen » 29 Aug 2018, 16:10

JasonL wrote:
29 Aug 2018, 16:04
If you don't think there are substantial segments of the demos who oppose drug liberalization you are not very observant.
After proposition 8 passed in California in 2008, it should have been obvious to Team Blue that there were plenty of socons in their camp.
If Trump supporters wanted a tough guy, why did they elect such a whiny bitch? - Mo

Those who know history are doomed to deja vu. - the innominate one

Never bring a knife to a joke fight" - dhex

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JasonL
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Re: Orange is the new President

Post by JasonL » 29 Aug 2018, 16:23

Here in the land of megachurches, every sign has anti drug messages and has for the past year or so. KY has an opioid issue, goes the common refrain. Don't let satan in.

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Hugh Akston
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Re: Orange is the new President

Post by Hugh Akston » 29 Aug 2018, 16:44

JasonL wrote:
29 Aug 2018, 16:23
Here in the land of megachurches, every sign has anti drug messages and has for the past year or so. KY has an opioid issue, goes the common refrain. Don't let satan in.
They probably say it again just as they're passing out the communion wine.
"Is a Lulztopia the best we can hope for?!?" ~Taktix®
"Inexplicably cockfighting monsters that live in your pants" ~Jadagul

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Eric the .5b
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Re: Orange is the new President

Post by Eric the .5b » 29 Aug 2018, 16:46

Aresen wrote:
29 Aug 2018, 16:10
JasonL wrote:
29 Aug 2018, 16:04
If you don't think there are substantial segments of the demos who oppose drug liberalization you are not very observant.
After proposition 8 passed in California in 2008, it should have been obvious to Team Blue that there were plenty of socons in their camp.
Well, yes. The problem for Blues is that their socons are black.
"Better that ten guilty persons escape than that one innocent suffer."
"Cyberpunk never really gave the government enough credit for their ability to secure a favorable prenup during the Corporate-State wedding." - Shem

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Jennifer
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Re: Orange is the new President

Post by Jennifer » 29 Aug 2018, 16:56

Eric the .5b wrote:
29 Aug 2018, 16:09
JasonL wrote:
29 Aug 2018, 16:04
If you don't think there are substantial segments of the demos who oppose drug liberalization you are not very observant.
Ayup. Getting past 50% support just means nearly 50% oppose it.
Yet the pro-legalization side has always managed to get its message out and even win converts without government authorities stepping in and saying "OMG we need to produce some propaganda to win hearts and minds to our side."
"Myself, despite what they say about libertarians, I think we're actually allowed to pursue options beyond futility or sucking the dicks of the powerful." -- Eric the .5b

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Eric the .5b
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Re: Orange is the new President

Post by Eric the .5b » 29 Aug 2018, 18:19

Jennifer wrote:
29 Aug 2018, 16:56
Eric the .5b wrote:
29 Aug 2018, 16:09
JasonL wrote:
29 Aug 2018, 16:04
If you don't think there are substantial segments of the demos who oppose drug liberalization you are not very observant.
Ayup. Getting past 50% support just means nearly 50% oppose it.
Yet the pro-legalization side has always managed to get its message out and even win converts without government authorities stepping in and saying "OMG we need to produce some propaganda to win hearts and minds to our side."
What do you mean by "Yet"?
"Better that ten guilty persons escape than that one innocent suffer."
"Cyberpunk never really gave the government enough credit for their ability to secure a favorable prenup during the Corporate-State wedding." - Shem

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Ellie
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Re: Orange is the new President

Post by Ellie » 29 Aug 2018, 18:21

Hugh Akston wrote:
29 Aug 2018, 16:44
JasonL wrote:
29 Aug 2018, 16:23
Here in the land of megachurches, every sign has anti drug messages and has for the past year or so. KY has an opioid issue, goes the common refrain. Don't let satan in.
They probably say it again just as they're passing out the communion wine.
Southern megachurches don't have WINE! That's papist bullshit. They have little test tubes of grape juice. (No, really.)
"NB stands for nota bene do not @ me" - nicole

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Jennifer
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Re: Orange is the new President

Post by Jennifer » 29 Aug 2018, 18:57

Eric the .5b wrote:
29 Aug 2018, 18:19
Jennifer wrote:
29 Aug 2018, 16:56
Eric the .5b wrote:
29 Aug 2018, 16:09
JasonL wrote:
29 Aug 2018, 16:04
If you don't think there are substantial segments of the demos who oppose drug liberalization you are not very observant.
Ayup. Getting past 50% support just means nearly 50% oppose it.
Yet the pro-legalization side has always managed to get its message out and even win converts without government authorities stepping in and saying "OMG we need to produce some propaganda to win hearts and minds to our side."
What do you mean by "Yet"?
"Yet" in contrast to the suggestion that Trump's actions in this particular instance are another example of him pandering to rather than opposing what "the public" wants.
"Myself, despite what they say about libertarians, I think we're actually allowed to pursue options beyond futility or sucking the dicks of the powerful." -- Eric the .5b

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Eric the .5b
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Re: Orange is the new President

Post by Eric the .5b » 29 Aug 2018, 19:30

Jennifer wrote:
29 Aug 2018, 18:57
Eric the .5b wrote:
29 Aug 2018, 18:19
Jennifer wrote:
29 Aug 2018, 16:56
Eric the .5b wrote:
29 Aug 2018, 16:09
JasonL wrote:
29 Aug 2018, 16:04
If you don't think there are substantial segments of the demos who oppose drug liberalization you are not very observant.
Ayup. Getting past 50% support just means nearly 50% oppose it.
Yet the pro-legalization side has always managed to get its message out and even win converts without government authorities stepping in and saying "OMG we need to produce some propaganda to win hearts and minds to our side."
What do you mean by "Yet"?
"Yet" in contrast to the suggestion that Trump's actions in this particular instance are another example of him pandering to rather than opposing what "the public" wants.
Right, but you said nothing to justify that.

In the first place, nobody said it was strictly the public. We all know how much law enforcement organizations push this. However, there are fucktons of people in "the public"—their being hundreds of millions of people and not a hivemind—who enthusiastically support law enforcement rhetoric and, yes, oppose drug liberalization. Otherwise, it wouldn't merely be in-progress in some states but a settled issue across the country.

In the second place, it's the same essential message the government has been pushing since back when most people were against marijuana legalization. The government's always pushing a line of a variety of subjects. However, it doesn't generally push lines that don't have a significant base of supporters, or even majority favor.
"Better that ten guilty persons escape than that one innocent suffer."
"Cyberpunk never really gave the government enough credit for their ability to secure a favorable prenup during the Corporate-State wedding." - Shem

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Jennifer
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Re: Orange is the new President

Post by Jennifer » 29 Aug 2018, 19:31

Ladies and gentlemen, the president of the United States. Who is totally a grownup as opposed to a petulant middle-schooler whose parents are utterly failing in their parental responsibilities vis a vis teaching their kid bare-minimum social skills.



(I wondered what CNN and Bernstein said to piss Trump off so much; presumably it is this):

"Myself, despite what they say about libertarians, I think we're actually allowed to pursue options beyond futility or sucking the dicks of the powerful." -- Eric the .5b

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Hugh Akston
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Re: Orange is the new President

Post by Hugh Akston » 29 Aug 2018, 19:34

Ellie wrote:
29 Aug 2018, 18:21
Hugh Akston wrote:
29 Aug 2018, 16:44
JasonL wrote:
29 Aug 2018, 16:23
Here in the land of megachurches, every sign has anti drug messages and has for the past year or so. KY has an opioid issue, goes the common refrain. Don't let satan in.
They probably say it again just as they're passing out the communion wine.
Southern megachurches don't have WINE! That's papist bullshit. They have little test tubes of grape juice. (No, really.)
Huh. My parents modest-sized Lutheran churches had a choice of wine or juice in little plastic cups. I assume the megachurches fire their Eucharist out of one of those pneumatic t-shirt guns.
"Is a Lulztopia the best we can hope for?!?" ~Taktix®
"Inexplicably cockfighting monsters that live in your pants" ~Jadagul

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Aresen
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Re: Orange is the new President

Post by Aresen » 29 Aug 2018, 19:37

Ellie wrote:
29 Aug 2018, 18:21
Hugh Akston wrote:
29 Aug 2018, 16:44
JasonL wrote:
29 Aug 2018, 16:23
Here in the land of megachurches, every sign has anti drug messages and has for the past year or so. KY has an opioid issue, goes the common refrain. Don't let satan in.
They probably say it again just as they're passing out the communion wine.
Southern megachurches don't have WINE! That's papist bullshit. They have little test tubes of grape juice. (No, really.)
I am disappoint.

I thought it was Jack Daniels.
If Trump supporters wanted a tough guy, why did they elect such a whiny bitch? - Mo

Those who know history are doomed to deja vu. - the innominate one

Never bring a knife to a joke fight" - dhex

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Aresen
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Re: Orange is the new President

Post by Aresen » 29 Aug 2018, 19:42

Hugh Akston wrote:
29 Aug 2018, 19:34
I assume the megachurches fire their Eucharist out of one of those pneumatic t-shirt guns.
No. It is much more tastefully done than that. They hold it in nets in the ceiling and release it with the balloon drops at the end of the service.
If Trump supporters wanted a tough guy, why did they elect such a whiny bitch? - Mo

Those who know history are doomed to deja vu. - the innominate one

Never bring a knife to a joke fight" - dhex

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Ellie
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Re: Orange is the new President

Post by Ellie » 29 Aug 2018, 20:14

Hugh Akston wrote:
29 Aug 2018, 19:34
Ellie wrote:
29 Aug 2018, 18:21
Hugh Akston wrote:
29 Aug 2018, 16:44
JasonL wrote:
29 Aug 2018, 16:23
Here in the land of megachurches, every sign has anti drug messages and has for the past year or so. KY has an opioid issue, goes the common refrain. Don't let satan in.
They probably say it again just as they're passing out the communion wine.
Southern megachurches don't have WINE! That's papist bullshit. They have little test tubes of grape juice. (No, really.)
Huh. My parents modest-sized Lutheran churches had a choice of wine or juice in little plastic cups. I assume the megachurches fire their Eucharist out of one of those pneumatic t-shirt guns.
If they even bother to HAVE Communion. Seems like most churches in the South don't even have it at all, just Powerpoint singing and a two-hour sermon. Or maybe they trot it out for Easter.

No matter how far my religious beliefs (or lack thereof) stray from my Catholic upbringing, I'll never stop clutching my pearls at the affrontery of thinking you can have church without a Eucharist. BLASPHEMERS.
"NB stands for nota bene do not @ me" - nicole

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Number 6
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Re: Orange is the new President

Post by Number 6 » 29 Aug 2018, 22:31

Ellie wrote:
29 Aug 2018, 20:14
Hugh Akston wrote:
29 Aug 2018, 19:34
Ellie wrote:
29 Aug 2018, 18:21
Hugh Akston wrote:
29 Aug 2018, 16:44
JasonL wrote:
29 Aug 2018, 16:23
Here in the land of megachurches, every sign has anti drug messages and has for the past year or so. KY has an opioid issue, goes the common refrain. Don't let satan in.
They probably say it again just as they're passing out the communion wine.
Southern megachurches don't have WINE! That's papist bullshit. They have little test tubes of grape juice. (No, really.)
Huh. My parents modest-sized Lutheran churches had a choice of wine or juice in little plastic cups. I assume the megachurches fire their Eucharist out of one of those pneumatic t-shirt guns.
If they even bother to HAVE Communion. Seems like most churches in the South don't even have it at all, just Powerpoint singing and a two-hour sermon. Or maybe they trot it out for Easter.

No matter how far my religious beliefs (or lack thereof) stray from my Catholic upbringing, I'll never stop clutching my pearls at the affrontery of thinking you can have church without a Eucharist. BLASPHEMERS.
I've been to a few churches that only do communion a few times a year. One-a rural church that distant family members took me to-passed around a plate of cubes of wonder bread. Nine years of Episcopal School and eight of Jesuit education cried out in my mind, "What the actual fuck?"
Protestants are weird.
" i discovered you eat dog dicks out of a bowl marked "dog dicks" because you're too stupid to remember where you left your bowl of dog dicks."-dhex, of course.
"Come, let us go forth and not rape together"-Jadagul

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