Whither the GOP? (post-Trump edition)

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Hugh Akston
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Re: Whither the GOP? (post-Trump edition)

Post by Hugh Akston » 25 Mar 2019, 10:42

Some of us heartily supported the Trumpian insurgency. Others reluctantly pulled the lever for Trump. Still others opposed his candidacy, adopted the label “Never Trump,” or even endorsed Hillary Clinton.

Yet more than two years later, we speak with one voice
Saying this doesn't make it true.
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Re: Whither the GOP? (post-Trump edition)

Post by nicole » 25 Mar 2019, 10:58

Hugh Akston wrote:
25 Mar 2019, 10:42
Some of us heartily supported the Trumpian insurgency. Others reluctantly pulled the lever for Trump. Still others opposed his candidacy, adopted the label “Never Trump,” or even endorsed Hillary Clinton.

Yet more than two years later, we speak with one voice
Saying this doesn't make it true.
I think it's talking specifically about the co-writers
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Re: Whither the GOP? (post-Trump edition)

Post by Jennifer » 25 Mar 2019, 14:18

What the fucking fuck?
In recent years, some have argued for immigration by saying that working-class Americans are less hard-working, less fertile, in some sense less worthy than potential immigrants. We oppose attempts to displace American citizens. Advancing the common good requires standing with, rather than abandoning, our countrymen. They are our fellow citizens, not interchangeable economic units. And as Americans we owe each other a distinct allegiance and must put each other first.
So... I take it when they watched footage of that vile Charlottesville rally, they nodded in agreement during the whole "Jews will not replace us" bit?

This paragraph seems to imply that "Americanism" is, like, some genetic thing rather than an ideal. Fact is, even if immigration is reduced to zero, pretty much EVERY current American citizen will be "displaced" a century from now ... on account of we're all going to freakin' DIE, and be replaced by children not yet born. Personally, I think the attitudes those children will be raised to have are a hell of a lot more important than those children's ethnic backgrounds.
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Re: Whither the GOP? (post-Trump edition)

Post by Jennifer » 25 Mar 2019, 14:27

Mo wrote:
25 Mar 2019, 06:50
If this is the direction the GOP is going, Trumpism looks like a local maxima rather than a local minima.

I mean, WTF does this even mean? Yay nationalism to own the people who travel a bunch?
We believe home matters.

For those who enjoy the upsides, a borderless world brings intoxicating new liberties. They can go anywhere, work anywhere. They can call themselves “citizens” of the world. But the jet-setters’ vision clashes with the human need for a common life. And it has bred resentments that are only beginning to surface. We embrace the new nationalism insofar as it stands against the utopian ideal of a borderless world that, in practice, leads to universal tyranny.

https://www.firstthings.com/web-exclusi ... -consensus
If you squint, it maybe-kinda makes sense IF you have the attitude "What is not forbidden is mandatory" -- either we can have a world where everyone is free to go wherever, or we can have a world where homebody-types are free to stay where they are and make a life for themselves there, but we can't possibly have both at once. (Or perhaps it's more accurate to say "This makes sense if you oppose open borders AND engage in massive Freudian projection -- the writers of this piece are clearly fine with forcing THEIR preferred mode of living on everyone else, so of course they assume everyone else wants to force their ways of living on them.)
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Re: Whither the GOP? (post-Trump edition)

Post by Aresen » 25 Mar 2019, 15:46

Reading through that is like reading a Creationist apologetic rejecting all the stuff they don't understand.

Also, I was amused by the appearance of the paleologism 'jet-setter'. I thought that phrase went out of use in the 1970s when air travel went mass-market.
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Re: Whither the GOP? (post-Trump edition)

Post by Hugh Akston » 25 Mar 2019, 20:27

They're also advocating a retrograde combination of nationalism and socialism that I thought went out of style back in the 40s.
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Re: Whither the GOP? (post-Trump edition)

Post by nicole » 25 Mar 2019, 22:13

Jennifer wrote:
25 Mar 2019, 14:27
Mo wrote:
25 Mar 2019, 06:50
If this is the direction the GOP is going, Trumpism looks like a local maxima rather than a local minima.

I mean, WTF does this even mean? Yay nationalism to own the people who travel a bunch?
We believe home matters.

For those who enjoy the upsides, a borderless world brings intoxicating new liberties. They can go anywhere, work anywhere. They can call themselves “citizens” of the world. But the jet-setters’ vision clashes with the human need for a common life. And it has bred resentments that are only beginning to surface. We embrace the new nationalism insofar as it stands against the utopian ideal of a borderless world that, in practice, leads to universal tyranny.

https://www.firstthings.com/web-exclusi ... -consensus
If you squint, it maybe-kinda makes sense IF you have the attitude "What is not forbidden is mandatory" -- either we can have a world where everyone is free to go wherever, or we can have a world where homebody-types are free to stay where they are and make a life for themselves there, but we can't possibly have both at once. (Or perhaps it's more accurate to say "This makes sense if you oppose open borders AND engage in massive Freudian projection -- the writers of this piece are clearly fine with forcing THEIR preferred mode of living on everyone else, so of course they assume everyone else wants to force their ways of living on them.)
It’s because it’s not about being a homebody, it’s about being a communitarian. The whole point is having other people to control.
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Re: Whither the GOP? (post-Trump edition)

Post by Warren » 25 Mar 2019, 22:55

Hugh Akston wrote:
25 Mar 2019, 20:27
They're also advocating a retrograde combination of nationalism and socialism that I thought went out of style back in the 40s.
And it isn't any less scary this time around.
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Re: Whither the GOP? (post-Trump edition)

Post by Andrew » 25 Mar 2019, 22:55

That had such a heavy neoreaction vibe that I expected a reference to Gnon near the end.
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Re: Whither the GOP? (post-Trump edition)

Post by Jennifer » 25 Mar 2019, 23:00

nicole wrote:
25 Mar 2019, 22:13
Jennifer wrote:
25 Mar 2019, 14:27
Mo wrote:
25 Mar 2019, 06:50
If this is the direction the GOP is going, Trumpism looks like a local maxima rather than a local minima.

I mean, WTF does this even mean? Yay nationalism to own the people who travel a bunch?
We believe home matters.

For those who enjoy the upsides, a borderless world brings intoxicating new liberties. They can go anywhere, work anywhere. They can call themselves “citizens” of the world. But the jet-setters’ vision clashes with the human need for a common life. And it has bred resentments that are only beginning to surface. We embrace the new nationalism insofar as it stands against the utopian ideal of a borderless world that, in practice, leads to universal tyranny.

https://www.firstthings.com/web-exclusi ... -consensus
If you squint, it maybe-kinda makes sense IF you have the attitude "What is not forbidden is mandatory" -- either we can have a world where everyone is free to go wherever, or we can have a world where homebody-types are free to stay where they are and make a life for themselves there, but we can't possibly have both at once. (Or perhaps it's more accurate to say "This makes sense if you oppose open borders AND engage in massive Freudian projection -- the writers of this piece are clearly fine with forcing THEIR preferred mode of living on everyone else, so of course they assume everyone else wants to force their ways of living on them.)
It’s because it’s not about being a homebody, it’s about being a communitarian. The whole point is having other people to control.
Like I said -- the writers of this piece are fine with forcing their preferred mode of living on everyone else.
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Re: Whither the GOP? (post-Trump edition)

Post by nicole » 26 Mar 2019, 08:27

Andrew wrote:
25 Mar 2019, 22:55
That had such a heavy neoreaction vibe that I expected a reference to Gnon near the end.
Lol...again, it’s First Things. Where do you think Nrx got this shit from? The people who really believe it and call him God.
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Re: Whither the GOP? (post-Trump edition)

Post by dead_elvis » 30 Jun 2019, 02:05

I find it simply stunning that the morons in east county re-elected this shitbag. Epitome of the new GOP.

Duncan Hunter defends campaign spending on affairs with staffers, lobbyists as ‘overtly political’ outlay
They also said that because the alleged relationships were with lobbyists and congressional staffers, prosecutors can’t prove all the expenses didn’t serve legitimate political purposes.

“Just as with Mr. Hunter’s platonic relationships, his friendships often blur the line between personal and professional, which is a widespread occurrence in modern politics,” the filing states.

“However unpopular the notion of a married man mixing business with pleasure, the Government cannot simply dismiss the reality that Mr. Hunter’s relationships with Individual’s 14-18 often served an overtly political purpose that would not have existed irrespective of his occupation."
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Re: Whither the GOP? (post-Trump edition)

Post by Jennifer » 30 Jun 2019, 04:56

And STILL, Republicans say they are the party of "family values."
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Re: Whither the GOP? (post-Trump edition)

Post by thoreau » 30 Jun 2019, 11:55

Jennifer wrote:And STILL, Republicans say they are the party of "family values."
Don't forget fiscal discipline.

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Re: Whither the GOP? (post-Trump edition)

Post by lunchstealer » 30 Jun 2019, 12:15

...the Government cannot simply dismiss the reality that Mr. Hunter’s relationships with Individual’s(sic) 14-18 often served an overtly political purpose that would not have existed irrespective of his occupation."
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Re: Whither the GOP? (post-Trump edition)

Post by dhex » 30 Jun 2019, 19:17

The Roy Moore gambit.
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Re: Whither the GOP? (post-Trump edition)

Post by Shem » 01 Jul 2019, 14:46

dead_elvis wrote:
30 Jun 2019, 02:05
I find it simply stunning that the morons in east county re-elected this shitbag. Epitome of the new GOP.
I think the bulk of the morons in question are actually in Susan Davis' district. Hunter's constituents are mostly rattlesnakes and the odd crank. Plus, the 50th has always had a high tolerance for criminality among their Representatives; they are the people who brought you Duke Cunningham years ago.
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Re: Whither the GOP? (post-Trump edition)

Post by Painboy » 19 Jul 2019, 14:31

Well this just sounds generally awful.

https://www.theatlantic.com/politics/ar ... ce/594202/
It might have been the first-ever nationalist revolt launched from a Ritz-Carlton ballroom. This week, conservative intellectuals and politicos in Washington tucked into plated dinners and sipped from at least four varieties of seltzer at a new gathering, the National Conservatism Conference. In defiance of conservative-movement shibboleths, they applauded new rallying cries: No more worshipping at the altar of free markets at the expense of the middle class. No more endless wars dedicated to slaying perceived monsters overseas. No more shame about saluting the flag, defending borders, and demanding assimilation. “Today,” declared Yoram Hazony, the American-educated Israeli scholar who organized the event, “is our independence day.”

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Re: Whither the GOP? (post-Trump edition)

Post by Warren » 19 Jul 2019, 14:56

Painboy wrote:
19 Jul 2019, 14:31
Well this just sounds generally awful.

https://www.theatlantic.com/politics/ar ... ce/594202/
It might have been the first-ever nationalist revolt launched from a Ritz-Carlton ballroom. This week, conservative intellectuals and politicos in Washington tucked into plated dinners and sipped from at least four varieties of seltzer at a new gathering, the National Conservatism Conference. In defiance of conservative-movement shibboleths, they applauded new rallying cries: No more worshipping at the altar of free markets at the expense of the middle class. No more endless wars dedicated to slaying perceived monsters overseas. No more shame about saluting the flag, defending borders, and demanding assimilation. “Today,” declared Yoram Hazony, the American-educated Israeli scholar who organized the event, “is our independence day.”
I can't for the life of me figure out what fuck they're going on about. Like they're very political about being against everybody else's politics. But what are they in favor of?
Mary Eberstadt, the socially conservative author and erstwhile think-tanker, compared libertarianism to moonshine.
And she says that like it's a bad thing?

I don't get it.
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Re: Whither the GOP? (post-Trump edition)

Post by Mo » 19 Jul 2019, 15:07

I’m surprised that Penn law professor Amy Wax’s comments weren’t in that article.

"In a panel on immigration, University of Pennsylvania law professor Amy Wax claimed that immigrants are too loud and responsible for an increase in 'litter.' She explicitly advocated an immigration policy that would favor immigrants from Western countries over non-Western ones; 'the position,' as she put it, 'that our country will be better off with more whites and fewer nonwhites.' (She claims this is not racist because her problem with nonwhite immigrants is cultural rather than biological.)"
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Re: Whither the GOP? (post-Trump edition)

Post by JasonL » 19 Jul 2019, 15:13

It's always nice to hear people say what they think out loud. That's one advantage of the current age of sadness - there isn't much hiding behind moderate language. Commies are commies and national racists are national racists and their newfound power is they shouldn't have to be ashamed to be awful anymore.

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Re: Whither the GOP? (post-Trump edition)

Post by nicole » 19 Jul 2019, 15:18

Oh yes, I'm obsessed with all these tools trying to draw a fine line between nationalism and patriotism. And Yoram Hazony, what a fucking jackass.

This was my first exposure to him:


Ah yes, childless adults, who sprang fully formed from the ground and have no experience of what it takes to make family life work.
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Re: Whither the GOP? (post-Trump edition)

Post by nicole » 19 Jul 2019, 15:19

Enjoyed this {fire} take earlier as well

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Re: Whither the GOP? (post-Trump edition)

Post by Jennifer » 19 Jul 2019, 17:32

Looking forward to the Republican movers and shakers repudiating this bigotry any second now!

A ha ha ha ha ha. Just kidding.


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Re: Whither the GOP? (post-Trump edition)

Post by Painboy » 27 Aug 2019, 22:38

The alt-right manifesto that has Trumpworld talking

I'm starting to think the alt-right movement is entirely predicated on a series of dares.
Where Ayn Rand’s “Atlas Shrugged” inspired generations of libertarians to enter politics, and Aaron Sorkin’s “The West Wing” did the same for idealistic liberals, a cohort of young, right-wing men are today gravitating toward “Bronze Age Mindset.” The self-published book urges them to join the armed forces in preparation for the onset of military rule.

Since its publication in June 2018, the book has gained a following online, and its author, known to his fans as BAP for short, has come to the attention of notable figures on the Trumpist right. Earlier this month, the book was the subject of a 5,000-word review by Michael Anton, a conservative intellectual who served as a spokesman for Donald Trump’s National Security Council. Anton concludes by warning, “In the spiritual war for the hearts and minds of the disaffected youth on the right, conservatism is losing. BAP-ism is winning.”
The 200-page book mixes Nietzschean philosophy with critiques of contemporary Western society, denigrating homosexuality, Judiasm, Islam, feminism and much else along the way. “Inside every noble Greek was an unquenchable lust for power,” is one fairly typical statement. “Modern world not bad just because modern,” is another, displaying the author’s habit of lapsing into broken English by dropping articles. The book claims that the leaders of the European Union have “tiny moleman eyes.” Many of its passages are profane and unprintable.

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