Whither the GOP? (post-Trump edition)

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Jennifer
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Whither the GOP? (post-Trump edition)

Post by Jennifer » 10 Sep 2016, 15:23

Yesterday afternoon, apparently only a few hours before Hillary Clinton referred to the various pro-Trump bigots as a "basket of deplorables," three white supremacist/"alt-right" leaders held a press conference to discuss the future of their movement:
...Spencer began the press conference by noting the “alt-right’s” unprecedented media moment. The movement, which has for years been relegated to the extreme racist fringes of the internet, has broken into the American public’s consciousness, thanks in large part to the “alt-right’s” vocal support of Trump’s anti-immigration platform. “We’re not just some marginal movement that you could dismiss,” Spencer told the room of supporters and journalists. “The fact is our ideas are so powerful that despite the fact that we’re doing all this on a shoe-string, we’re getting at people. We’re affecting them. They know we’re right.”

Indeed, the Trump campaign has helped bring the racist "alt-right" movement into the mainstream -- rubbing elbows with white nationalists, echoing many of their common themes, and demonizing Muslims and immigrants.

That willingness to flirt with the racist fringe is what has captured the imagination of people like Spencer, who see in Trump a "leader" who is willing to shirk norms when talking about race and identity. “He seems to be willing to go there, he seems to be willing to confront people. And that is very different from the cuckold.”

Spencer described Trump’s campaign as a kind of jumping-off point for the “alt-right” -- an opportunity to introduce their pro-white agenda to a broad national audience. “Certainly we have been, you could say, riding his coattails, there’s been more interest in us because we’re generally pro-Trump, because we’re inspired by him and things like that.”

The press conference also featured a significant amount of the explicitly racist rhetoric that one would expect from white nationalists -- Taylor argued that blacks and Latinos are genetically predisposed to have lower IQs and behave less ethically than whites, Spencer waxed poetic about the importance of protecting a white cultural identity in America, and all three speakers expressed concern about the influence of Jewish people in American politics....
I still think/hope Trump will lose this election, because white bigots do not comprise the majority of American voters (even though white people still do). But I'm genuinely concerned: what is the post-2016 GOP going to look like? I've said for years now that the Democratic Party sucks but it won't improve until the Republicans do, because the Dems know they won't have to; they only need be less noxious than the GOP. And that was when the GOP was still promoting hardcore social conservatism ... but NOT the open, no-dog-whistle racism being brought out into the open by Trump supporters.

Based on a (thoroughly unscientific) perusal of people on Facebook and Twitter, I get the impression that even a lot of right-wingers who ordinarily would deplore open racism are nonetheless circling the wagons in this case, because condemning the racists would require them to admit that Hillary Clinton was actually right about something.

Is the GOP ever (within my lifetime) going to return to its alleged old-school values of "small government, fiscal responsibility and personal freedom?" Is it going to split into two factions -- the old-school values party and the hardcore social-conservatives? Or even splinter into three, with the third branch being the openly racist wing?

And a corollary question: how much worse are the Democrats going to get these next few election cycles, if they know "We've pretty much got a lock on all voters who do NOT want to see white-power ethno-nationalism become U.S. government policy?"
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Re: Whither the GOP? (post-Trump edition)

Post by Eric the .5b » 10 Sep 2016, 21:34

Good questions. I'd like to think Trump will be a turning-point. (But then, I'd like Trump to show up at an interview with an uncharacteristically thoughtful expression and say, "I've been doing some thinking, and...I'm full of shit with this campaign. I'm just being a blowhard and saying things I don't believe, and it's just finally hit me that this is real and not just that random, laughable bullshit you say to get suckers to dump money down your pants.")
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Re: Whither the GOP? (post-Trump edition)

Post by Jennifer » 12 Sep 2016, 15:08

Jennifer wrote: I get the impression that even a lot of right-wingers who ordinarily would deplore open racism are nonetheless circling the wagons in this case, because condemning the racists would require them to admit that Hillary Clinton was actually right about something.
Aaaaand it's happening. Apparently Trump's campaign decided to turn the "deplorables" comment into a campaign ad: a quote of Hillary mentioning the "racist, sexist, Islamophobic" etc. aspects of Trump's supporters, followed NOT by any Trumpian attempt to disavow this, but by scenes of people at Trump rallies cheering. Fuck.
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Re: Whither the GOP? (post-Trump edition)

Post by Highway » 12 Sep 2016, 15:18

I don't think that's "circling the wagons", I think that's trying to say "Yeah, this is what their definition of racism is: normal people."

It's like that article thoreau linked in the other thread, where the people in Louisiana didn't think they were "racists". They "didn't use the 'n' word", or "hate" muslims. They just "have concerns" and "point out the obvious". That's not "racism".
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Re: Whither the GOP? (post-Trump edition)

Post by Jennifer » 12 Sep 2016, 15:46

Highway wrote:I don't think that's "circling the wagons", I think that's trying to say "Yeah, this is what their definition of racism is: normal people."

It's like that article thoreau linked in the other thread, where the people in Louisiana didn't think they were "racists". They "didn't use the 'n' word", or "hate" muslims. They just "have concerns" and "point out the obvious". That's not "racism".
I skimmed through that article after he posted it; those people have FAR more "plausible deniability" that do the Trumpsters. "Hey, there's nothing racist about claiming that Mexican immigrants are all rapists! There's nothing sexist about snidely suggesting that if a woman asks you a question you don't want to answer, she must've been menstruating at the time!"

If any significant portion of the GOP's "never Trumpers" have publicly defended the "deplorables" comment, I've not had the pleasure of seeing it.

It reminds me of something I read recently: given how extremely politicized the whole "manmade climate change" business is today, it's easy to forget that it was not considered a partisan issue until Al Gore published his book about it. Before that, both sides of the political aisle agreed that yes, global warming is real, and is caused by human activities increasing the levels of atmospheric greenhouse gases; the "only" disagreement was over "What, if anything, should be done about it?" Only after a divisive Democrat wrote a book on the subject did Republicans start large-scale embracing of climate-change denial -- anything to avoid admitting That Guy from the Opposite Team might be correct about anything at all.

So: we're stuck with a two-party system, and now and apparently for the foreseeable future, one of those parties has pretty much abandoned all principles except "We must disagree with the Democrat." If the Democrat thinks climate change is a problem, then of course we have to claim climate change isn't even real. If the Democrat is appalled by a candidate's rank bigotry, then of course we have to either deny he's a bigot, or even argue that such bigotry is a good and useful thing. (See "I'm not a racist; I'm a race realist." Or, "Hating Mexicans isn't racist, because 'Mexican' is not a race.")
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Re: Whither the GOP? (post-Trump edition)

Post by lunchstealer » 12 Sep 2016, 17:37

Highway wrote:I don't think that's "circling the wagons", I think that's trying to say "Yeah, this is what their definition of racism is: normal people."

It's like that article thoreau linked in the other thread, where the people in Louisiana didn't think they were "racists". They "didn't use the 'n' word", or "hate" muslims. They just "have concerns" and "point out the obvious". That's not "racism".
I've been to a few political rallies in the deep South, back when the taboo against dropping the n-bomb was just starting to take hold, and I never once heard it yelled out, even when a speaker mentioned Jesse Jackson or the like (Jackson is from upstate South Carolina, one county over from my alma mater, so it was more common than elsewhere).

Boisterous ejaculations of the n-bomb are not uncommon at Trump rallies, and the individual responsible is not shooshed or confronted in any way in any of the video I've seen. Racism is WAY too welcome in the Trump campaign.
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Re: Whither the GOP? (post-Trump edition)

Post by Jennifer » 12 Sep 2016, 18:20

lunchstealer wrote: Racism is WAY too welcome in the Trump campaign.
As is racist mob violence. Remember these nuggets from earlier in Trump's campaign?

At a November campaign rally in Alabama, Trump supporters physically attacked an African-American protester after the man began chanting “Black lives matter.” Video of the incident shows the assailants kicking the man after he has already fallen to the ground.

The following day, Trump implied that the attackers were justified.

"Maybe [the protester] should have been roughed up," he mused. "It was absolutely disgusting what he was doing."

A black protester at Trump's rally today in Alabama was shoved, tackled, punched & kicked: https://t.co/Aq0wuaAtax pic.twitter.com/cTRDMtjuBl
— Jeremy Diamond (@JDiamond1) November 21, 2015

Trump’s dismissive attitude toward the protester is part of a larger, troubling pattern of instigating violence toward protesters at campaign events that has singled out people of color.
And this:
Trump’s racial incitement has already inspired hate crimes. Two brothers arrested in Boston last summer for beating up a homeless Latino man cited Trump’s anti-immigrant message when explaining why they did it.

“Donald Trump was right -- all these illegals need to be deported,” one of the men reportedly told police officers.

Trump did not even bother to distance himself from them. Instead, he suggested that the men were well-intentioned and had simply gotten carried away.

"I will say that people who are following me are very passionate,” Trump said. “They love this country and they want this country to be great again. They are passionate.”
He won't simply avoid condemning such violence; he encourages it.
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Re: Whither the GOP? (post-Trump edition)

Post by Jennifer » 13 Sep 2016, 15:00

So ... Mike Pence has zero problem with such Trumpian epithets as "Crooked Hillary," "Lyin' Ted," "Little Marco" and so forth, but when asked if David Duke is "deplorable," he piously refused to engage in "name-calling."

Nope, I don't see the GOP repudiating open racism and other nasty Trumpisms in time for the 2020 election. Dammit.
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Re: Whither the GOP? (post-Trump edition)

Post by Eric the .5b » 13 Sep 2016, 18:21

Jennifer wrote:So ... Mike Pence has zero problem with such Trumpian epithets as "Crooked Hillary," "Lyin' Ted," "Little Marco" and so forth, but when asked if David Duke is "deplorable," he piously refused to engage in "name-calling."

Nope, I don't see the GOP repudiating open racism and other nasty Trumpisms in time for the 2020 election. Dammit.
They're a write-off until at least 2024. The most they'll do is keep (or lose and regain) majorities in one or both houses of Congress.
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Re: Whither the GOP? (post-Trump edition)

Post by Aresen » 13 Sep 2016, 18:34

Eric the .5b wrote:
Jennifer wrote:So ... Mike Pence has zero problem with such Trumpian epithets as "Crooked Hillary," "Lyin' Ted," "Little Marco" and so forth, but when asked if David Duke is "deplorable," he piously refused to engage in "name-calling."

Nope, I don't see the GOP repudiating open racism and other nasty Trumpisms in time for the 2020 election. Dammit.
They're a write-off until at least 2024. The most they'll do is keep (or lose and regain) majorities in one or both houses of Congress.
A strong recession could change that. As thoreau pointed out in another thread, the economy has been on an upswing for several years now (not a strong upswing, but up nevertheless). It could continue through Clinton's first term or the economy could tank in 2017. If unemployment goes above 9%, a conventional GOP candidate could win in 2020.
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Re: Whither the GOP? (post-Trump edition)

Post by Jennifer » 13 Sep 2016, 18:38

Eric the .5b wrote:
Jennifer wrote:So ... Mike Pence has zero problem with such Trumpian epithets as "Crooked Hillary," "Lyin' Ted," "Little Marco" and so forth, but when asked if David Duke is "deplorable," he piously refused to engage in "name-calling."

Nope, I don't see the GOP repudiating open racism and other nasty Trumpisms in time for the 2020 election. Dammit.
They're a write-off until at least 2024.
And -- assuming they continue clinging to those specific platform planks and personal habits which alienate non-white voters -- by 2024 the demographics will be even worse for the GOP than they are today. The rate I recall reading during the 2012 election season -- when Romney eventually won a higher percentage of white voters than Reagan did, but still lost -- was that each presidential election, the percentage of white voters relative to non-white drops an additional 3 percent.
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Re: Whither the GOP? (post-Trump edition)

Post by Eric the .5b » 13 Sep 2016, 20:11

Aresen wrote:
Eric the .5b wrote:
Jennifer wrote:So ... Mike Pence has zero problem with such Trumpian epithets as "Crooked Hillary," "Lyin' Ted," "Little Marco" and so forth, but when asked if David Duke is "deplorable," he piously refused to engage in "name-calling."

Nope, I don't see the GOP repudiating open racism and other nasty Trumpisms in time for the 2020 election. Dammit.
They're a write-off until at least 2024. The most they'll do is keep (or lose and regain) majorities in one or both houses of Congress.
A strong recession could change that. As thoreau pointed out in another thread, the economy has been on an upswing for several years now (not a strong upswing, but up nevertheless). It could continue through Clinton's first term or the economy could tank in 2017. If unemployment goes above 9%, a conventional GOP candidate could win in 2020.
People said that about 2012. At this point, I don't believe it.
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Re: Whither the GOP? (post-Trump edition)

Post by thoreau » 13 Sep 2016, 20:42

In 2012 unemployment was better than it was in 2008. It was pretty clear by the middle of 2012 that, barring a sudden financial collapse, the conditions in November would favor the incumbent party. In 2016 the unemployment rate is better than it was in 2012, and thus it is reasonable to assume that economic conditions will favor the incumbent party.

Here in 2016 I will not offer a detailed prediction of the 2020 economy with any high degree of confidence, but I will say that there's at least a better than 50-50 chance that unemployment will rise by more than 1% at some point during Clinton's term. Even if things start recovering by 2020, the electorate takes a while to forget pain. That doesn't automatically mean Clinton would lose in 2020 if there's an unemployment spike, but it would certainly give her opponents a huge opportunity. Could they blow it? Of course. I co-sign everything that anyone here has ever said about the problems that the Republicans have given themselves.

But I also think that hubris is at least as dangerous as any external adversary. When people start saying "Our opponents are so weak, and our society has changed so much, that we could not lose an election even in a recession" that's when I start to recall what they said about the unsinkable Titanic...
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Re: Whither the GOP? (post-Trump edition)

Post by Eric the .5b » 13 Sep 2016, 21:04

thoreau wrote:But I also think that hubris is at least as dangerous as any external adversary. When people start saying "Our opponents are so weak, and our society has changed so much, that we could not lose an election even in a recession" that's when I start to recall what they said about the unsinkable Titanic...
And that will get them slapped by the midterms, not losing the presidency. When Obama got re-elected, unemployment had improved to 8%, down from ~10% (and back down to about when he took office). Bush got re-elected with a lower unemployment rate, but still one most of two points higher than when he took office.

Now, alright, another crisis like 2008 would make Clinton vulnerable, but Team Red has nobody we know of who could exploit it enough to win. These last two presidents, neither party has been able to take down incumbents with shitty records.
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Re: Whither the GOP? (post-Trump edition)

Post by Jennifer » 13 Sep 2016, 21:21

Here in 2016 I will not offer a detailed prediction of the 2020 economy with any high degree of confidence, but I will say that there's at least a better than 50-50 chance that unemployment will rise by more than 1% at some point during Clinton's term. Even if things start recovering by 2020, the electorate takes a while to forget pain. That doesn't automatically mean Clinton would lose in 2020 if there's an unemployment spike, but it would certainly give her opponents a huge opportunity.
Except, assuming the 2020 GOP doesn't explicitly repudiate Trumpism/the alt-right influence on the party and current base -- which would require a large-scale rewrite of what Trumpence is peddling now -- how bad does unemployment have to get for people to vote for the party which says "My friends and family and I are exactly what's wrong with America today!" Remember, we're not even talking about the old-school (pre-last summer) "social conservative" GOP; this is the "doesn't want to offend the fucking Klan" GOP of Trumpence, appealing to an ever-shrinking American demographic while actively antagonizing everyone outside it.
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Re: Whither the GOP? (post-Trump edition)

Post by thoreau » 13 Sep 2016, 21:22

Eric the .5b wrote:
thoreau wrote:But I also think that hubris is at least as dangerous as any external adversary. When people start saying "Our opponents are so weak, and our society has changed so much, that we could not lose an election even in a recession" that's when I start to recall what they said about the unsinkable Titanic...
And that will get them slapped by the midterms, not losing the presidency. When Obama got re-elected, unemployment had improved to 8%, down from ~10% (and back down to about when he took office). Bush got re-elected with a lower unemployment rate, but still one most of two points higher than when he took office.
Both of those guys show that timing matters. Unemployment had been declining for more than a year when Bush The Lesser was re-elected by a very narrow margin. Obama was re-elected more comfortably, and after 3 years of declining unemployment.

https://www.google.com/publicdata/explo ... l=en&dl=en

Also, the unemployment rate had started rising before Obama took office, with a huge spike right before he was first elected, so people naturally blamed the previous guy. Unemployment was just wobbling near a minimum when Bush was elected, and the first thing his team did was to start "talking down the economy." Blues made some silly noises about him hurting the economy, but in reality all he was doing was managing expectations.

Bush The Elder actually presided over the start of a recovery, but unemployment hadn't really caught up with it yet, so he lost his bid for a second term. After 12 years of Republican rule he couldn't credibly blame the Democrats for the recession (never mind that he himself shouldn't have been blamed either) so he lost. Clinton will be in the same boat if there's a recession on her watch. Bush The Elder followed Reagan, who inherited a shitty economy from Carter, saw it continue to get worse, then enjoyed a recovery. She's following Barack Augustus, who enjoyed a similar ride, and if she gets to see a recession on her watch (not guaranteed but quite possible) then she'll be in for a rough ride.

All that said, I freely concede that the Republicans could screw up and lose in 2020. But I think it's dangerous to under-estimate the fundamentals.
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Re: Whither the GOP? (post-Trump edition)

Post by thoreau » 13 Sep 2016, 21:23

Jennifer wrote:
Here in 2016 I will not offer a detailed prediction of the 2020 economy with any high degree of confidence, but I will say that there's at least a better than 50-50 chance that unemployment will rise by more than 1% at some point during Clinton's term. Even if things start recovering by 2020, the electorate takes a while to forget pain. That doesn't automatically mean Clinton would lose in 2020 if there's an unemployment spike, but it would certainly give her opponents a huge opportunity.
Except, assuming the 2020 GOP doesn't explicitly repudiate Trumpism/the alt-right influence on the party and current base -- which would require a large-scale rewrite of what Trumpence is peddling now -- how bad does unemployment have to get for people to vote for the party which says "My friends and family and I are exactly what's wrong with America today!" Remember, we're not even talking about the old-school (pre-last summer) "social conservative" GOP; this is the "doesn't want to offend the fucking Klan" GOP of Trumpence, appealing to an ever-shrinking American demographic while actively antagonizing everyone outside it.
Good point. I had not previously considered the fact that the GOP has gone crazy. Thanks for bringing that to my attention. I will have to think about it.
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Re: Whither the GOP? (post-Trump edition)

Post by Jennifer » 13 Sep 2016, 22:50

thoreau wrote:
Jennifer wrote:
Here in 2016 I will not offer a detailed prediction of the 2020 economy with any high degree of confidence, but I will say that there's at least a better than 50-50 chance that unemployment will rise by more than 1% at some point during Clinton's term. Even if things start recovering by 2020, the electorate takes a while to forget pain. That doesn't automatically mean Clinton would lose in 2020 if there's an unemployment spike, but it would certainly give her opponents a huge opportunity.
Except, assuming the 2020 GOP doesn't explicitly repudiate Trumpism/the alt-right influence on the party and current base -- which would require a large-scale rewrite of what Trumpence is peddling now -- how bad does unemployment have to get for people to vote for the party which says "My friends and family and I are exactly what's wrong with America today!" Remember, we're not even talking about the old-school (pre-last summer) "social conservative" GOP; this is the "doesn't want to offend the fucking Klan" GOP of Trumpence, appealing to an ever-shrinking American demographic while actively antagonizing everyone outside it.
Good point. I had not previously considered the fact that the GOP has gone crazy. Thanks for bringing that to my attention. I will have to think about it.
Specifically, they've adopted a particular substrain of crazy that runs directly counter to every demographic reality of the past generation or so. Unemployment or the economy isn't going to be a factor for the GOP until and unless it completely backtracks away from almost everything it's been doing this past year at minimum. Hence the question: assuming/hoping Trump gets trounced, what direction with the national GOP go then?
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Re: Whither the GOP? (post-Trump edition)

Post by Jennifer » 14 Sep 2016, 14:14

Here's something from July 2015 -- shortly after Dylann Roof's murder-spree stripped away much of the "heritage, not hate!" camouflage from the Confederate battle flag -- where Matt Welch suggested a Trump-free dichotomy of possibilities for the future of the GOP:
Jennifer wrote:M. Welch wrote a piece on H&R today calling Trump the "Idiocracy candidate," but he has one good, Trump-free quote which IMO does a good job of summarizing the current GOP dilemma in a nutshell:
Republicans could be the party of South Carolina Gov. Nikki Haley, whose respectful-to-all-sides speech last month about lowering the Confederate battle flag over her state's capitol was one of the genuinely great pieces of recent American oratory. Or it can be the party of bestselling conservative entertainer Ann Coulter, who snorted ignorantly on Kennedy that Haley "is an immigrant and does not understand America's history," and then when called out on the collectivist error (Haley was born in South Carolina) tweeted out: "2d gen immigrant, as she constantly brags. Maj. Nidal Hasan, Anwar al-Awlaki, Octomom -we R getting the best ppl!"
The party of Haley might have a good political future in America, but the party of Coulter will only grow more irrelevant on a national scale (though it will still win elections in various places). Right now, the Coulterites seem to be sucking up most of the oxygen in the GOP tent.
In the 14 months since, I've not seen any reliable indication the GOP wants to be the party of Haley anytime soon; it's getting more Coultery every day.
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Re: Whither the GOP? (post-Trump edition)

Post by Jennifer » 19 Sep 2016, 14:10

FUCKLEDUCKS AND GODDAMMIT. Trending on Facebook this afternoon is the story that RNC chairman Reince Preibus is thinking of "penalizing" GOP members who refuse to endorse Trump this election. Which bodes very, very ill indeed for any notion that the Republicans will learn anything from this Trump debacle.
Republican National Committee Chairman Reince Priebus said Sunday that it’s high time for Donald Trump’s former primary challengers to come on board and support his campaign—and suggested there could be trouble for them in 2020 or 2024 if they don’t.

“Those people need to get on board,” he told CBS’ “Face the Nation.” “And if they’re thinking they’re going to run again someday, I think that we’re going to evaluate the process – of the nomination process and I don’t think it’s going to be that easy for them.”

Several of Trump’s former Republican primary opponents, including Ohio Gov. John Kasich, Texas Sen. Ted Cruz, and former Florida Gov. Jeb Bush have not endorsed Trump in the months since the GOP businessman secured the nomination. Asked explicitly whether that meant there would be penalties for the handful of 2016 Republican hopefuls who have not endorsed Trump if they opted to run again in 2020 or 2024, Priebus said nothing has been decided but that it’s something the party will “look at.” ...
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Re: Whither the GOP? (post-Trump edition)

Post by Kwix » 19 Sep 2016, 14:39

Jennifer wrote:FUCKLEDUCKS AND GODDAMMIT. Trending on Facebook this afternoon is the story that RNC chairman Reince Preibus is thinking of "penalizing" GOP members who refuse to endorse Trump this election. Which bodes very, very ill indeed for any notion that the Republicans will learn anything from this Trump debacle.
Republican National Committee Chairman Reince Priebus said Sunday that it’s high time for Donald Trump’s former primary challengers to come on board and support his campaign—and suggested there could be trouble for them in 2020 or 2024 if they don’t.

“Those people need to get on board,” he told CBS’ “Face the Nation.” “And if they’re thinking they’re going to run again someday, I think that we’re going to evaluate the process – of the nomination process and I don’t think it’s going to be that easy for them.”

Several of Trump’s former Republican primary opponents, including Ohio Gov. John Kasich, Texas Sen. Ted Cruz, and former Florida Gov. Jeb Bush have not endorsed Trump in the months since the GOP businessman secured the nomination. Asked explicitly whether that meant there would be penalties for the handful of 2016 Republican hopefuls who have not endorsed Trump if they opted to run again in 2020 or 2024, Priebus said nothing has been decided but that it’s something the party will “look at.” ...
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Jennifer
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Re: Whither the GOP? (post-Trump edition)

Post by Jennifer » 19 Sep 2016, 14:45

No, bad! Baaaaaad! For all the ways the Democratic Party sucks, it's not going to improve until after the Republicans do, because it won't have to; all it needs to do is be less-odious than the GOP. And Trump has set the bar so fucking low that for now, "We Dems aren't going to encode ethno-nationalist bigotry into law" is all it takes to be less-odious than the GOP.

Bad enough that our electoral college plus various court decisions have effectively turned the country into a two-party state (at least where presidential elections are concerned) ... but a one-party state would be far worse.
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lunchstealer
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Re: Whither the GOP? (post-Trump edition)

Post by lunchstealer » 19 Sep 2016, 16:20

Warren, avert your eyes.

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Aresen
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Re: Whither the GOP? (post-Trump edition)

Post by Aresen » 19 Sep 2016, 18:03

Jennifer wrote:FUCKLEDUCKS AND GODDAMMIT. Trending on Facebook this afternoon is the story that RNC chairman Reince Preibus is thinking of "penalizing" GOP members who refuse to endorse Trump this election. Which bodes very, very ill indeed for any notion that the Republicans will learn anything from this Trump debacle.
You are assuming that Trump is going to be a catastrophe for the GOP.

The polling numbers do not suggest that. The latest numbers are showing a gap of no more than 5% in the popular vote (a few are even showing him ahead).
This assumes that there is no preference-hiding among Trump supporters.

The 'debacle' may be that he gets elected.
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D.A. Ridgely
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Re: Whither the GOP? (post-Trump edition)

Post by D.A. Ridgely » 19 Sep 2016, 18:16

Aresen wrote:
The 'debacle' may be that he gets elected.
Yeah, but the lulz, the LULZ!

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