You think Ukraine is joke?

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Fin Fang Foom
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Re: You think Ukraine is joke?

Post by Fin Fang Foom » 24 Mar 2014, 21:04

France may be laughing all the way to the bank, since they are the world leader in actually workable green energy.

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D.A. Ridgely
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Re: You think Ukraine is joke?

Post by D.A. Ridgely » 24 Mar 2014, 21:22

Fin Fang Foom wrote:France may be laughing all the way to the bank, since they are the world leader in actually workable green energy.
As in nuclear?

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Fin Fang Foom
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Re: You think Ukraine is joke?

Post by Fin Fang Foom » 24 Mar 2014, 21:26

D.A. Ridgely wrote:
Fin Fang Foom wrote:France may be laughing all the way to the bank, since they are the world leader in actually workable green energy.
As in nuclear?
Yes. Russia was going to run out of gas someday, but being a dick probably means alternate sources of energy will become more important to Europe sooner. They do have some oil sands, and France can always ship electricity around. Germans don't like nuclear, but I wouldn't be surprised if Eastern Europe gave less of a shit.

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Aresen
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Re: You think Ukraine is joke?

Post by Aresen » 24 Mar 2014, 21:53

Fin Fang Foom wrote:
D.A. Ridgely wrote:
Fin Fang Foom wrote:France may be laughing all the way to the bank, since they are the world leader in actually workable green energy.
As in nuclear?
Yes. Russia was going to run out of gas someday, but being a dick probably means alternate sources of energy will become more important to Europe sooner. They do have some oil sands, and France can always ship electricity around. Germans don't like nuclear, but I wouldn't be surprised if Eastern Europe gave less of a shit.
If it was any other administration in Washington right now, they would be sending delegations to Europe saying: "We've been fracking some really nice natural gas lately. Would you like to buy brand USA instead of brand Putin?"

Putin, of course, can turn around and sell to China. I am not sure that the Chinese would consider Russia a reliable supplier.

If Prince Vlad lost all his customers, it could get very sticky for him without hard currency to buy off his constituency in Russia.
If Trump supporters wanted a tough guy, why did they elect such a whiny bitch? - Mo

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Fin Fang Foom
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Re: You think Ukraine is joke?

Post by Fin Fang Foom » 24 Mar 2014, 22:00

Aresen wrote:
Fin Fang Foom wrote:
D.A. Ridgely wrote:
Fin Fang Foom wrote:France may be laughing all the way to the bank, since they are the world leader in actually workable green energy.
As in nuclear?
Yes. Russia was going to run out of gas someday, but being a dick probably means alternate sources of energy will become more important to Europe sooner. They do have some oil sands, and France can always ship electricity around. Germans don't like nuclear, but I wouldn't be surprised if Eastern Europe gave less of a shit.
If it was any other administration in Washington right now, they would be sending delegations to Europe saying: "We've been fracking some really nice natural gas lately. Would you like to buy brand USA instead of brand Putin?"

Putin, of course, can turn around and sell to China. I am not sure that the Chinese would consider Russia a reliable supplier.

If Prince Vlad lost all his customers, it could get very sticky for him without hard currency to buy off his constituency in Russia.
Right now, U.S. gas is behind a regulatory wall and you'd have to build infrastructure to produce and ship LNG, which will take at least a few years. I don't know that shipping will happen since cheap gas is in the Constitution that exists in most Americans' heads. Technology and expertise may move, though, and in any event, I expect Europe is interested in removing any leverage Putin may hold.

Still, the big problem for Russia in the long run is the too much drinkin' and not enough fuckin' issue. Russia's economy is weakening, and Putin may not last too long anyways. Russians might like to pretend they're tough, but if that were an inborn trait, queuing wouldn't have helped kill the Soviet Union.

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Aresen
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Re: You think Ukraine is joke?

Post by Aresen » 24 Mar 2014, 22:19

Before the Soviet Union fell, I figured that it could either reform itself, undergo a violent revolution or go the way of seventeenth century Spain - live off resource extraction while slowly declining as a world power, all the while deluding itself it was still a major player.

I had hoped after 1991, Russia would take the first course. Instead, Putin has chosen the third one. By 2100, Russia will be irrelevant.
If Trump supporters wanted a tough guy, why did they elect such a whiny bitch? - Mo

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Never bring a knife to a joke fight" - dhex

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Mo
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Re: You think Ukraine is joke?

Post by Mo » 24 Mar 2014, 23:18

Aresen wrote:
Fin Fang Foom wrote:
D.A. Ridgely wrote:
Fin Fang Foom wrote:France may be laughing all the way to the bank, since they are the world leader in actually workable green energy.
As in nuclear?
Yes. Russia was going to run out of gas someday, but being a dick probably means alternate sources of energy will become more important to Europe sooner. They do have some oil sands, and France can always ship electricity around. Germans don't like nuclear, but I wouldn't be surprised if Eastern Europe gave less of a shit.
If it was any other administration in Washington right now, they would be sending delegations to Europe saying: "We've been fracking some really nice natural gas lately. Would you like to buy brand USA instead of brand Putin?"

Putin, of course, can turn around and sell to China. I am not sure that the Chinese would consider Russia a reliable supplier.

If Prince Vlad lost all his customers, it could get very sticky for him without hard currency to buy off his constituency in Russia.
That's kinda what we've been doing now, but per FFF, we're quite a ways off from the building infrastructure POV.
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Shem
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Re: You think Ukraine is joke?

Post by Shem » 24 Mar 2014, 23:45

Aresen wrote:Before the Soviet Union fell, I figured that it could either reform itself, undergo a violent revolution or go the way of seventeenth century Spain - live off resource extraction while slowly declining as a world power, all the while deluding itself it was still a major player.

I had hoped after 1991, Russia would take the first course. Instead, Putin has chosen the third one. By 2100, Russia will be irrelevant.
Try 2030.
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Re: You think Ukraine is joke?

Post by Hugh Akston » 25 Mar 2014, 02:40

The good news is that the Ukraine crisis is a nail, and the even better news is that Billy Kristol has just the tool to fix it.
It will still be a rough time. America can’t be strong with a president committed to weakness. But the prospects for a restoration of American strength will be brighter, the challenges of 2017 will be less daunting, if the opposition today stands clearly and unequivocally for American strength and leadership, and—dare one say it?—for American greatness.
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Re: You think Ukraine is joke?

Post by dhex » 25 Mar 2014, 07:32

God he writes like a dork.
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Aresen
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Re: You think Ukraine is joke?

Post by Aresen » 25 Mar 2014, 10:27

Hugh Akston wrote:The good news is that the Ukraine crisis is a nail, and the even better news is that Billy Kristol has just the tool to fix it.
It will still be a rough time. America can’t be strong with a president committed to weakness. But the prospects for a restoration of American strength will be brighter, the challenges of 2017 will be less daunting, if the opposition today stands clearly and unequivocally for American strength and leadership, and—dare one say it?—for American greatness.
Yep. The Ukraine, which Russia regards as its private zone, would be a perfect place to show the Russians that the USA IS STILL BOSS.
If Trump supporters wanted a tough guy, why did they elect such a whiny bitch? - Mo

Those who know history are doomed to deja vu. - the innominate one

Never bring a knife to a joke fight" - dhex

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D.A. Ridgely
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Re: You think Ukraine is joke?

Post by D.A. Ridgely » 25 Mar 2014, 11:49

Aresen wrote:
Hugh Akston wrote:The good news is that the Ukraine crisis is a nail, and the even better news is that Billy Kristol has just the tool to fix it.
It will still be a rough time. America can’t be strong with a president committed to weakness. But the prospects for a restoration of American strength will be brighter, the challenges of 2017 will be less daunting, if the opposition today stands clearly and unequivocally for American strength and leadership, and—dare one say it?—for American greatness.
Yep. The Ukraine, which Russia regards as its private zone, would be a perfect place to show the Russians that the USA IS STILL BOSS.
Though, come to think of it, maybe the timing is right for a Bay of Pigs II.

*grin*

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Re: You think Ukraine is joke?

Post by GinSlinger » 30 Apr 2014, 06:57

Okay, yes, I am beginning to think the Ukraine is joke.

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Re: You think Ukraine is joke?

Post by tr0g » 30 Apr 2014, 09:47

GinSlinger wrote:Okay, yes, I am beginning to think the Ukraine is joke.
That's simultaneously hilarious and disturbing.
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Re: You think Ukraine is joke?

Post by Taktix® » 30 Apr 2014, 09:53

tr0g wrote:
GinSlinger wrote:Okay, yes, I am beginning to think the Ukraine is joke.
That's simultaneously hilarious and disturbing.
Maybe the average Ukranian could tell he wasn't a real soldier and didn't feel like playing along with his stupid prank?
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Fin Fang Foom
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Re: You think Ukraine is joke?

Post by Fin Fang Foom » 30 Apr 2014, 10:15

Taktix® wrote:
tr0g wrote:
GinSlinger wrote:Okay, yes, I am beginning to think the Ukraine is joke.
That's simultaneously hilarious and disturbing.
Maybe the average Ukranian could tell he wasn't a real soldier and didn't feel like playing along with his stupid prank?
Or the Ukrainians are smart enough to avoid getting into a shooting war with the Russians?

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Shem
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Re: You think Ukraine is joke?

Post by Shem » 01 May 2014, 03:01

Fin Fang Foom wrote:
Taktix® wrote:
tr0g wrote:
GinSlinger wrote:Okay, yes, I am beginning to think the Ukraine is joke.
That's simultaneously hilarious and disturbing.
Maybe the average Ukranian could tell he wasn't a real soldier and didn't feel like playing along with his stupid prank?
Or the Ukrainians are smart enough to avoid getting into a shooting war with the Russians?
Yeah, I strongly suspect the central government has told everyone not to be the guy who gives Russia an excuse to go Abkhazia on Eastern Ukraine.
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Re: You think Ukraine is joke?

Post by Hugh Akston » 01 May 2014, 16:55

Ukraine's interim president: We will not be slaves of the Russian government, we will only be slaves of the Ukrainian government.
Hours later, Ukraine's acting president ordered that the military draft be renewed, citing "threats of encroachment on the nation's territorial integrity" and interference by Russia in its internal affairs.
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Re: You think Ukraine is joke?

Post by thoreau » 01 May 2014, 17:21

Drafting Eastern Ukrainians will just make it easier for them to seize Ukrainian bases for Russia, because they will already be authorized to be on the base. It will help bring this crisis to a much faster resolution.
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Re: You think Ukraine is joke?

Post by Ayn_Randian » 01 May 2014, 22:10

Taktix<img src= wrote:
">[quote="Taktix"]
tr0g wrote:
GinSlinger wrote:Okay, yes, I am beginning to think the Ukraine is joke.
That's simultaneously hilarious and disturbing.
Maybe the average Ukranian could tell he wasn't a real soldier and didn't feel like playing along with his stupid prank?
You would be surprised how far you can get looking and acting like you belong there and know what you're doing.
It has the effect of making me want desperately to do the opposite of what Green Day is suggesting I should want to do. Billy Joe Whassname may have created a generation of war mongers. - Jason L