There must be a pony in here somewhere.

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Aresen
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Re: There must be a pony in here somewhere.

Post by Aresen »

I thought a lot of union members (though not their bosses) already had crossed the aisle because 'the Chinese and the Mexicans and the Canadians took r jerbs'.
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Mo
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Re: There must be a pony in here somewhere.

Post by Mo »

Yeah, at this point unions have been gutted or their members have gone full kultur war that Dems can safely ignore all but the teachers unions
his voice is so soothing, but why do conspiracy nuts always sound like Batman and Robin solving one of Riddler's puzzles out loud? - fod

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Warren
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Re: There must be a pony in here somewhere.

Post by Warren »

Mo wrote: 16 Feb 2020, 17:36 Yeah, at this point unions have been gutted or their members have gone full kultur war that Dems can safely ignore all but the teachers unions
What about TSA, and Corrections Officers?
Nobody, men included, wants a world where men treat women with the same respect they show to other men. - thoreau
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Mo
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Re: There must be a pony in here somewhere.

Post by Mo »

Yeah, pretty sure the Dems don’t need them at all
his voice is so soothing, but why do conspiracy nuts always sound like Batman and Robin solving one of Riddler's puzzles out loud? - fod

no one ever yells worldstar when a pet gets fucked up - dhex
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Ellie
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Re: There must be a pony in here somewhere.

Post by Ellie »

NOBODY does.
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JasonL
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Re: There must be a pony in here somewhere.

Post by JasonL »

I wonder how many unionish voters are being surrendered to trump tho.
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Hugh Akston
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Re: There must be a pony in here somewhere.

Post by Hugh Akston »

JasonL wrote: 16 Feb 2020, 21:08 I wonder how many unionish voters are being surrendered to trump tho.
I wonder how much Team Trump is trying to court those voters.
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JasonL
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Re: There must be a pony in here somewhere.

Post by JasonL »

Hugh Akston wrote: 16 Feb 2020, 23:04
JasonL wrote: 16 Feb 2020, 21:08 I wonder how many unionish voters are being surrendered to trump tho.
I wonder how much Team Trump is trying to court those voters.
Not through the Union lens but through the America first lens. See farmers who are victims of the trade war. Hey love the guy. I hear guys in manufacturing and hvac and physical plant type jobs talk about “at least he tries”.
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Ellie
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Re: There must be a pony in here somewhere.

Post by Ellie »

JasonL wrote: 17 Feb 2020, 08:42 See farmers who are victims of the trade war. They love the guy.
That MPR interview with farmers in Iowa that I linked to recently -- that really broke my brain. I feel so confused and despondent about American politics now.

(Edited to add: I didn't feel great about them before, obvs, but this is another level of fatalism.)
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Mo
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Re: There must be a pony in here somewhere.

Post by Mo »

his voice is so soothing, but why do conspiracy nuts always sound like Batman and Robin solving one of Riddler's puzzles out loud? - fod

no one ever yells worldstar when a pet gets fucked up - dhex
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JasonL
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Re: There must be a pony in here somewhere.

Post by JasonL »

The no co pay thing - the idea that it should cost literally nothing at point of delivery - is a wacky outlier but is a core principle of the Bernie view.
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Mo
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Re: There must be a pony in here somewhere.

Post by Mo »

I agree. It’s the stupidest part of the whole thing
his voice is so soothing, but why do conspiracy nuts always sound like Batman and Robin solving one of Riddler's puzzles out loud? - fod

no one ever yells worldstar when a pet gets fucked up - dhex
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D.A. Ridgely
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Re: There must be a pony in here somewhere.

Post by D.A. Ridgely »

Bernie doesn't believe in the information value of pricing, so what are the chances he's going to understand moral hazard?
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Hugh Akston
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Re: There must be a pony in here somewhere.

Post by Hugh Akston »

Too Many Kinds of Deodorant: The Healthcare Policy
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JasonL
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Re: There must be a pony in here somewhere.

Post by JasonL »

Hahaha.
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Warren
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Re: There must be a pony in here somewhere.

Post by Warren »

I'd buy that for a dollar!
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Dangerman
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Re: There must be a pony in here somewhere.

Post by Dangerman »

Why are Switzerland and Israel on that list if they don't match any of the features of the Bernie plan?
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Hugh Akston
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Re: There must be a pony in here somewhere.

Post by Hugh Akston »

Dangerman wrote: 18 Feb 2020, 15:48 Why are Switzerland and Israel on that list if they don't match any of the features of the Bernie plan?
I think he's saying you can have universal healthcare or refuge from the Nazis, but not both.
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Mo
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Re: There must be a pony in here somewhere.

Post by Mo »

Dangerman wrote: 18 Feb 2020, 15:48 Why are Switzerland and Israel on that list if they don't match any of the features of the Bernie plan?
Because they have universal healthcare. The Netherlands is also all no (Israel has a varies). But The Netherlands and Switzerland have a universal healthcare system, but also a sufficiently regulated private insurance sector that even for those not on public insurance, everyone gets covered. The Vox article on The Netherlands has a decent, albeit incomplete, primer on the Dutch system which is similar to the Swiss system. It’s basically Obamacare with more regulation and less sabotage because the insurance companies knew the alternative was a public system.
his voice is so soothing, but why do conspiracy nuts always sound like Batman and Robin solving one of Riddler's puzzles out loud? - fod

no one ever yells worldstar when a pet gets fucked up - dhex
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Dangerman
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Re: There must be a pony in here somewhere.

Post by Dangerman »

Cool thanks.
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Mo
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Re: There must be a pony in here somewhere.

Post by Mo »

I’m curious to see what the terms of health care is post-Brexit (as in after the ramp down). Right now there is reciprocity between EU nations, so retired Brits in Spain and Portugal get free healthcare. Post Brexit they’ll either have to pay or come to the U.K. for medical care.
his voice is so soothing, but why do conspiracy nuts always sound like Batman and Robin solving one of Riddler's puzzles out loud? - fod

no one ever yells worldstar when a pet gets fucked up - dhex
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JasonL
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Re: There must be a pony in here somewhere.

Post by JasonL »

Mo wrote: 19 Feb 2020, 15:03 I’m curious to see what the terms of health care is post-Brexit (as in after the ramp down). Right now there is reciprocity between EU nations, so retired Brits in Spain and Portugal get free healthcare. Post Brexit they’ll either have to pay or come to the U.K. for medical care.
I read a thing maybe in the Economist like a year ago saying pensioners were terrified of this but only after they voted Brexit.
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Mo
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Re: There must be a pony in here somewhere.

Post by Mo »

JasonL wrote: 19 Feb 2020, 15:05
Mo wrote: 19 Feb 2020, 15:03 I’m curious to see what the terms of health care is post-Brexit (as in after the ramp down). Right now there is reciprocity between EU nations, so retired Brits in Spain and Portugal get free healthcare. Post Brexit they’ll either have to pay or come to the U.K. for medical care.
I read a thing maybe in the Economist like a year ago saying pensioners were terrified of this but only after they voted Brexit.
Yep. Many tiny violins will play if a suitable reciprocal treaty isn’t worked out. I suspect Spain, France and Portugal will play ball, but it will cost NHS a pretty penny.
his voice is so soothing, but why do conspiracy nuts always sound like Batman and Robin solving one of Riddler's puzzles out loud? - fod

no one ever yells worldstar when a pet gets fucked up - dhex
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Hugh Akston
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Re: There must be a pony in here somewhere.

Post by Hugh Akston »

Mo wrote: 19 Feb 2020, 16:54
JasonL wrote: 19 Feb 2020, 15:05
Mo wrote: 19 Feb 2020, 15:03 I’m curious to see what the terms of health care is post-Brexit (as in after the ramp down). Right now there is reciprocity between EU nations, so retired Brits in Spain and Portugal get free healthcare. Post Brexit they’ll either have to pay or come to the U.K. for medical care.
I read a thing maybe in the Economist like a year ago saying pensioners were terrified of this but only after they voted Brexit.
Yep. Many tiny violins will play if a suitable reciprocal treaty isn’t worked out. I suspect Spain, France and Portugal will play ball, but it will cost NHS a pretty penny.
Then Farage can get his bus repainted to brag how awesome it is that the UK sends all of its NHS money to Europe.
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Jennifer
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Re: There must be a pony in here somewhere.

Post by Jennifer »

Mo wrote: 19 Feb 2020, 15:03 I’m curious to see what the terms of health care is post-Brexit (as in after the ramp down). Right now there is reciprocity between EU nations, so retired Brits in Spain and Portugal get free healthcare. Post Brexit they’ll either have to pay or come to the U.K. for medical care.
Not exactly what you asked about, but ... there's a Metafilter thread from yesterday about the Guardian article headlined "UK to close door to non-English speakers and unskilled workers" (which I linked on the Brexit thread) -- Metafilter is of course a very lefty blog, pro-socialized medicine and anti-Brexit -- and this was one of the comments on it (disclaimer: I have not verified any of these stats):
It has been noted, that if you wanted to cut the NHS and adjacent social services off at the knees then THIS is a great single swipe way to achieve that.

Once the creaky health care infrastructure starts crumbling then those already primed can carve it up into Nice Profitable packages and sell it off to their business friends.

Earning Figures from the tweet of a Doctor in Oxford [UK]

Under Boris Johnson’s new rules anyone earning less than £25.6k is an unskilled worker.

NHS starting salaries:

Nurse £24.2k
Paramedic 24.2k
Midwife £24.2k
Radiographer £24.2k
Care assistant £17.6k
Physiotherapist £24.2k
Occupational therapist £24.2k

So this has the compound multiple effects of being hideously racist, economically stupid, will demonstrably decrease the quality of life for people who need social healthcare AND horribly undermining the NHS
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