There must be a pony in here somewhere.

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Warren
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Re: There must be a pony in here somewhere.

Post by Warren » 19 Jun 2018, 11:00

nicole wrote:
19 Jun 2018, 10:24
Yeah
I see. Well nicole, I'd say you're a Bitchin' Babe.
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thoreau
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Re: There must be a pony in here somewhere.

Post by thoreau » 10 Jul 2018, 18:40

Trump thinks he will negotiate cheap prescription drugs for Americans.

"ike Wile E. Coyote salivating over a "4000 Ways To Prepare Roadrunner" cookbook without watching his surroundings, the Road Runner of Societal Inertia snuck up on them both and beepbeeped them off the mesa."
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Re: There must be a pony in here somewhere.

Post by Aresen » 10 Jul 2018, 19:33

thoreau wrote:
10 Jul 2018, 18:40
Trump thinks he will negotiate cheap prescription drugs for Americans.

The Canute School of Economics.
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Ellie
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Re: There must be a pony in here somewhere.

Post by Ellie » 10 Jul 2018, 19:40

Maybe his dream is to be the most Spam Email-est president ever.
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Painboy
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Re: There must be a pony in here somewhere.

Post by Painboy » 10 Jul 2018, 20:10

He really does think he's Caesar.

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Aresen
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Re: There must be a pony in here somewhere.

Post by Aresen » 10 Jul 2018, 20:17

Painboy wrote:
10 Jul 2018, 20:10
He really does think he's Caesar.
Gaius Julius Caesar Augustus Germanicus?
If Trump supporters wanted a tough guy, why did they elect such a whiny bitch? - Mo

Those who know history are doomed to deja vu. - the innominate one

Never bring a knife to a joke fight" - dhex

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thoreau
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Re: There must be a pony in here somewhere.

Post by thoreau » 10 Jul 2018, 20:31

Painboy wrote:He really does think he's Caesar.
Or Czar.
"ike Wile E. Coyote salivating over a "4000 Ways To Prepare Roadrunner" cookbook without watching his surroundings, the Road Runner of Societal Inertia snuck up on them both and beepbeeped them off the mesa."
--Shem

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Re: There must be a pony in here somewhere.

Post by Dangerman » 10 Jul 2018, 20:45

Painboy wrote:
10 Jul 2018, 20:10
He really does think he's Caesar.
"What's this thing? "ROMANES EUNT DOMUS"? "People called Romanes they go the house?" "

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thoreau
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Re: There must be a pony in here somewhere.

Post by thoreau » 10 Jul 2018, 21:29

Dangerman wrote:
Painboy wrote:
10 Jul 2018, 20:10
He really does think he's Caesar.
"What's this thing? "ROMANES EUNT DOMUS"? "People called Romanes they go the house?" "
That's a solid thread win.
"ike Wile E. Coyote salivating over a "4000 Ways To Prepare Roadrunner" cookbook without watching his surroundings, the Road Runner of Societal Inertia snuck up on them both and beepbeeped them off the mesa."
--Shem

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nicole
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Re: There must be a pony in here somewhere.

Post by nicole » 11 Jul 2018, 08:14

"Fucking qualia." -Hugh Akston

"This is why I carry a shoehorn.” -jadagul

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Re: There must be a pony in here somewhere.

Post by Dangerman » 11 Jul 2018, 10:43

Guys. What if Trump fixes Obamacare by calling Congress "a bunch of doughy retards who wouldn't last ten minutes in the shoes of an average American worker."

What then?

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JasonL
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Re: There must be a pony in here somewhere.

Post by JasonL » 11 Jul 2018, 10:47

So far smells same as making deals with CEOs to bring air conditioner jobs back to america.

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Re: There must be a pony in here somewhere.

Post by Dangerman » 11 Jul 2018, 11:04

I think the Best Korea situation is heavy enough of a counter example that I'm not as confident about that as I was a year ago.

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Re: There must be a pony in here somewhere.

Post by Andrew » 11 Jul 2018, 11:41

Dangerman wrote:
11 Jul 2018, 10:43
Guys. What if Trump fixes Obamacare by calling Congress "a bunch of doughy retards who wouldn't last ten minutes in the shoes of an average American worker."

What then?
It would cement my belief that we are living in the most amusing timeline.
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Re: There must be a pony in here somewhere.

Post by Aresen » 11 Jul 2018, 15:44

JasonL wrote:
11 Jul 2018, 10:47
So far smells same as making deals with CEOs to bring air conditioner jobs back to america.
Trump knows. (He tells us.)

Actually, I am beginning to think of Trump as America's Perón.
If Trump supporters wanted a tough guy, why did they elect such a whiny bitch? - Mo

Those who know history are doomed to deja vu. - the innominate one

Never bring a knife to a joke fight" - dhex

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thoreau
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Re: There must be a pony in here somewhere.

Post by thoreau » 11 Jul 2018, 16:09

Aresen wrote:
11 Jul 2018, 15:44
JasonL wrote:
11 Jul 2018, 10:47
So far smells same as making deals with CEOs to bring air conditioner jobs back to america.
Trump knows. (He tells us.)

Actually, I am beginning to think of Trump as America's Perón.
22dc-melania-top-articleLarge-v2.jpg
22dc-melania-top-articleLarge-v2.jpg (44.68 KiB) Viewed 581 times
"Don't cry for me Red America,
The truth is I never cared for you,
All through these wild days,
I was Resistance,
I leaked his secrets,
I knew his weakness."
"ike Wile E. Coyote salivating over a "4000 Ways To Prepare Roadrunner" cookbook without watching his surroundings, the Road Runner of Societal Inertia snuck up on them both and beepbeeped them off the mesa."
--Shem

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Mo
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Re: There must be a pony in here somewhere.

Post by Mo » 20 Jul 2018, 09:30

Do you want socialized medicine? Because this is how you get socialized medicine.
On the first morning of Jang Yeo-im’s vacation to San Francisco in 2016, her eight-month-old son Park Jeong-whan fell off the bed in the family’s hotel room and hit his head.

There was no blood, but the baby was inconsolable. Jang and her husband worried he might have an injury they couldn’t see, so they called 911, and an ambulance took the family — tourists from South Korea — to Zuckerberg San Francisco General Hospital.

The doctors at the hospital quickly determined that baby Jeong-whan was fine — just a little bruising on his nose and forehead. He took a short nap in his mother’s arms, drank some infant formula, and was discharged a few hours later with a clean bill of health.

...

Two years later, the bill finally arrived at their home: They owed the hospital $18,836 for the 3 hour and 22 minute visit, the bulk of which was for a mysterious fee for $15,666 labeled “trauma activation,” which sometimes is known as “a trauma response fee.”
So $18K for a check-up, some formula and a seat?
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Fin Fang Foom
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Re: There must be a pony in here somewhere.

Post by Fin Fang Foom » 20 Jul 2018, 12:27

I do almost wonder whether such fees are a plot by hospitals to convince everyone of single payer or if business side stupidity (combined with doctor Rain Man-ism about money) is the reason. Probably the latter.

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Re: There must be a pony in here somewhere.

Post by JD » 24 Jul 2018, 11:11

There is also the issue, AFAICT, that hospital "prices" are pretty meaningless, because virtually nobody ever actually pays the list price. Most of the time the insurance company negotiates a different price with the hospital, and then the actual patient may or may not pay part of that, etc.
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Mo
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Re: There must be a pony in here somewhere.

Post by Mo » 25 Jul 2018, 04:52

JD wrote:
24 Jul 2018, 11:11
There is also the issue, AFAICT, that hospital "prices" are pretty meaningless, because virtually nobody ever actually pays the list price. Most of the time the insurance company negotiates a different price with the hospital, and then the actual patient may or may not pay part of that, etc.
The second you send a bill to a person, the "This isn't our real price" defense falls apart.
his voice is so soothing, but why do conspiracy nuts always sound like Batman and Robin solving one of Riddler's puzzles out loud? - fod

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JasonL
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Re: There must be a pony in here somewhere.

Post by JasonL » 25 Jul 2018, 08:47

Both are true. The master billing lists were built on the premise that insurance was negotiating the real price. That said the world has shifted and more people are not covered in the same way and providers are at present insufficiently incentivized to modify their top line prices. Basically because they can get them much of the time. Pricing disclosures based on trailing 12 months of actual billing practices for uninsured and insured parties would be a good regulatory reform to start with. Start with transparency and see where you get.

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Re: There must be a pony in here somewhere.

Post by Warren » 25 Jul 2018, 09:14

JasonL wrote:
25 Jul 2018, 08:47
Both are true. The master billing lists were built on the premise that insurance was negotiating the real price. That said the world has shifted and more people are not covered in the same way and providers are at present insufficiently incentivized to modify their top line prices. Basically because they can get them much of the time. Pricing disclosures based on trailing 12 months of actual billing practices for uninsured and insured parties would be a good regulatory reform to start with. Start with transparency and see where you get.
You're not going to surgically regulate your way out of this. As long as 3rd party payer remains the standard, and it will, the system is irrevocably broken and all we can do is choose the form of the destructor.
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Mo
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Re: There must be a pony in here somewhere.

Post by Mo » 25 Jul 2018, 09:22

You're never going to get away from 3rd party payer systems. As long as there are treatments that cost hundreds of thousands of dollars that you want more than a few dozen people to use annually, there will be a need for 3rd party payers.
his voice is so soothing, but why do conspiracy nuts always sound like Batman and Robin solving one of Riddler's puzzles out loud? - fod

no one ever yells worldstar when a pet gets fucked up - dhex

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JasonL
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Re: There must be a pony in here somewhere.

Post by JasonL » 25 Jul 2018, 09:25

Warren wrote:
25 Jul 2018, 09:14
JasonL wrote:
25 Jul 2018, 08:47
Both are true. The master billing lists were built on the premise that insurance was negotiating the real price. That said the world has shifted and more people are not covered in the same way and providers are at present insufficiently incentivized to modify their top line prices. Basically because they can get them much of the time. Pricing disclosures based on trailing 12 months of actual billing practices for uninsured and insured parties would be a good regulatory reform to start with. Start with transparency and see where you get.
You're not going to surgically regulate your way out of this. As long as 3rd party payer remains the standard, and it will, the system is irrevocably broken and all we can do is choose the form of the destructor.
I don't think this is exactly true, in that some forms of the destructor are way worse than others and trajectory improvement in things like pricing shock can affect public sentiment away from "screw it price caps on everything forever", which i think is one of the most important things we can do - get to a coverage model that does not rely on political price caps, maximizes choice and ideally creates two models that recognize catastrophic cost events as different from the other 99% of medical transactions.

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Warren
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Re: There must be a pony in here somewhere.

Post by Warren » 25 Jul 2018, 11:07

JasonL wrote:
25 Jul 2018, 09:25
get to a coverage model that does not rely on political price caps, maximizes choice and ideally creates two models that recognize catastrophic cost events as different from the other 99% of medical transactions.
You absolutely can not get there incrementally. We are on a path to single payer. To get off that path you need revolution. Period.
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